Author Topic: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85  (Read 5900 times)

Offline DozyDora

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James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« on: Friday 05 August 11 11:39 BST (UK) »
I am still trying to find the birth record of James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85

James Edward Morgan is shown as son of Edward Morgan (coal porter, not brewer's servant) and Harriet (nee Kalaher).  James is shown as Edward aged 6 in the 1891 Census (living at but doesn't show in the 1901 or 1911 Census.  He is stated to have been born in St Pancras but I have ordered several certificates of either James Edward Morgan, Edward James Morgan and either name on their own in various parts of London and all of them turn out to be wrong.  I have access to the LMA and have looked for illegimate births under Kalaher and Morgan and found a few under Kalaher but not Harriet, but one of her sisters.  There is no christening for him either ...

... Yet 9 years later Harriet and Edward go on to have 3 more sons:

Thomas George Morgan born 2 Feb 1893, Christened 6 March 1893.

William Morgan born 19 Aug 1895, christened in a private baptism on 17 Jan 1896 and his death record is shown in Mar 1896, so he could have died shortly after he was christened.

Henry Joseph Morgan (my partner’s grandfather) born 13 April 1897, christened on 19 May 1897.

As you will note all 3 sons were christened yet there are no birth or christening records for James Edward Morgan, so why would Harriet and Edward meticulously christen 3 of their children and not James Edward Morgan?  Also why the 9 year gap, given that there was no family planning in those days?  Was one of them in prison or was James somebody else’s illegimate child?


Offline lizdb

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #1 on: Friday 05 August 11 15:34 BST (UK) »
When did Edward and Harriet marry? Was it before or after edward's birth?
I must admit I cant see the marriage.
SO where did Harriet's maiden name come from?
Could she have been married before, and thus Edward's birth and her marriage to Mr M be under her first husband's surname?
Edmonds/Edmunds - mainly Sussex
DeBoo - London
Green - Suffolk
Parker - Sussex
Kemp - Essex
Farrington - Essex
Boniface - West Sussex

census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline DozyDora

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #2 on: Friday 05 August 11 16:14 BST (UK) »
I cannot find a marriage for Harriet Kalaher to Edward Morgan.

Harriet is one of 11 children of John Kalaher and Julia Prince, who married on 23.09.1861:

Julia Eliza Kalaher (01.02.1855)
John Kalaher (22.03.1858)
William Kalaher (15.02.1861)
Anne Kalaher (20.01.1862)
Louisa Kalaher (09.09.1893)
Thomas Kalaher (24.06.1865)
Harriet Kalaher (09.08.1867)
Mary Kalaher (Dec 1869) - have not found a baptism record for her
Edward (Mar 1872) - again no baptism record found
Julia Kalaher (1874) - no birth or baptism record found, only Census's
Florence Kalaher (1877) - again no birth or baptism record found, only Census's

Their firstborn Julia Eliza married Charles Henry Lock and had 16 children, the 3rd of which was James Edward Lock.  I ordered his birth certificate in case he was the James Edward I was looking for but he was the son of Julia and Charles.


Offline lizdb

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #3 on: Friday 05 August 11 16:18 BST (UK) »
So how do you know that the Harriett Morgan with Edward as his wife on the 1891 census, was the same person as Harriet Kalahar?
Edmonds/Edmunds - mainly Sussex
DeBoo - London
Green - Suffolk
Parker - Sussex
Kemp - Essex
Farrington - Essex
Boniface - West Sussex

census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline DozyDora

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #4 on: Friday 05 August 11 16:33 BST (UK) »
I have a copy of their son Henry Joseph Morgan's birth certificate which states that her maiden name was Kalaher.

Offline DozyDora

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #5 on: Friday 05 August 11 16:45 BST (UK) »
Oh I see what you are getting at!!  All I know is my partner's Dad Edward William Morgan, who is one of Henry Joseph Morgan's sons has a letter written by James Edward Morgan from Shanghai (he was Chief Inspector, Public Works Department, Shanghai Municipal Council) saying how glad he was to have met Henry at their uncle George's house because he never knew he had a brother!  I don't have the letter to hand but I do have others written by him and they were written cira 1930's.

In a letter dated 28.03.1932 he states:

"Dear James I wonder if you could spare the time and call at Somerset House and look up the Register of Births and let me know the exact year and date I was born in.  I would like you to try and get me a duplicate copy of my Birth Certificate, if possible, because I will have to produce it before I can leave the Municipal Council on a pension.  If you should manage please don’t forget and Register the letter, if not please don’t forget to send year and date when I was born as I am a little mixed up – been too long out here.  When you write, please let me know what expenses you have to go to and I will forward with return mail.

Well James, old boy, there is not much more to say, except we have had a week quietness around the fighting line as both parties, Chinese and Japanese are holding meeting at the British Consulate to try and fix up peace times, so far no result but we are all in hopes they will end the meetings in peace.  Nearly all the houses around the Settlement are blown to pieces, also Railway Stations and the Forts at Woosung, the entrance to the River and to Shanghai, a few houses in the Northern part of the Settlement where the Japanese troops were allotted to look after are damaged either by fire or shell, including my house.

Well I must close now with the very best of wishes and kind regards to you and your Good Wife and Nellie.  So cheerio and best of luck.

Please try and get me the copy mentioned, if not I will have to write after I receive your answer to this.  Cheerio.

I remain Yours Sincerely Brother Edward"

The family did try and get a copy of his birth certificate and my partner’s Dad still has a copy of the application, but they stated that Harriet’s maiden name was Calier, not Kalaher.

Although Henry was christened Henry Joseph, when James Edward died in 1948 he left the residue of his estate to his brother Henry James Morgan in his Will, so we think this is why he called him James.

Offline lizdb

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #6 on: Friday 05 August 11 17:02 BST (UK) »
It does seem a real muddle!
IF this letter is from Edward (who you say was known as James) then it is strange that the brother Henry Joseph was also known as James.
Edmonds/Edmunds - mainly Sussex
DeBoo - London
Green - Suffolk
Parker - Sussex
Kemp - Essex
Farrington - Essex
Boniface - West Sussex

census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline lizdb

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #7 on: Friday 05 August 11 17:15 BST (UK) »
Have you got the family in 1901?
I cant see them anywhere!
Edmonds/Edmunds - mainly Sussex
DeBoo - London
Green - Suffolk
Parker - Sussex
Kemp - Essex
Farrington - Essex
Boniface - West Sussex

census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline DozyDora

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Re: James Edward Morgan born cira 1884/85
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 06 August 11 12:35 BST (UK) »
No, this is the trouble - there doesn't seem to be any trace of any of the family after that 1891 Census.  I have records of all the LMA baptisms except James's, which states that their father's profession is a coal porter, a position he held from the age of 17 when he is shown visting as brother-in-law at 10 Seymour Mews in the 1881 Census, and his death certificate also lists him as a coal porter, yet he just disappears.  He is also listed as being a coal porter on Henry and Ellen's marriage certificate.

I have found a Harriet Morgan stated to be single, but born in Kensington, not St Giles, working as a domestic nurse in both the 1901 and 1911 Census, but our Harriet Morgan abandoned her children and left Henry Joseph Morgan on somebody's doorstep, so would someone as calous as that then go on to be a domestic nurse?

I realise now that in the 1891 Census where Edward Morgan is stated to be son, he may be son to Edward Morgan - coal porter, but not necessarily Harriet's son because they only state the relationship to the Head of a family in the Census.  So maybe I need to look for a marriage of Edward Morgan - coal porter before he got together with Harriet.

There is a 1901 Census where a James Morgan, born in Greenwich, London, in 1885 is in St Joseph and St Anne's Orphanage in Farnborough and is a shoemaker (RG 13/692), and I've found Thomas George Morgan in another orphanage but I cannot be sure of these.