Author Topic: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland  (Read 10384 times)

Offline suds

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Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« on: Thursday 29 December 11 12:17 GMT (UK) »
Hello

Whilst looking into some distant ancestors in Ireland, I came across the following on Googlebooks:

Harris (Lakeview, Blackrock, co. Cork) confirmed to William Prittie Harris, Esq, of that place (of the family of Harris, of Assolas, co. Cork), son of the late William Harris, of  Kilbarney, and grandson of Richard Harris of Lisgriffin Castle, co. Cork, and their descendents. Az. A chev. Betw. Three hedgehogs or, on a chief ar. As many cinquefoils pierced gu. Crest - A demi lion ramp. Or, holding betw. The paws a cinquefoil pierced gu. Motto - Industria veritas et hospitalis

The book I was looking at was:

The General armory of England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales. Comprising a registry of armorial bearings from the earliest to the present time

Bernard Burke

I would be grateful for a translation of the above to give me an idea of what the arms look like and if anyone could provide a picture I would be more than happy.

Suds

Offline Liz_in_Sussex

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 29 December 11 17:35 GMT (UK) »
 :D

Hi,

I love heraldry but am only a beginner ... so here is my attempt while you wait for the experts to come along.

Az = azure = blue.  Chev = chevron.  Or = gold.  Chief = the top third downwards.  Ar = argent = silver.  As many = I'm not sure how many there should be??  Cinquefoils = 5 leaved.  Pierced = with the hole in the middle.  Gu = gules = red.

I’m not sure how to draw the crest – but "a demi lion rampant" would be the top half of a lion with his paws in the air – and I think he will be gold, holding a red pierced cinquefoil between his upraised paws – but I’m sure someone who knows much much more than me will be along to help you!  (The lion is probably on top and the motto below?)

I've never seen hedgehogs on arms before - they are so cute - the ones on my picture below are crawling along - but I don't know if they really would be in that position.

I look forward to seeing what it really looks like!  :o

Liz
Research interests:
Sussex (Isted, Trusler, Pullen, Botting), Surrey (Isted), Shropshire (Hayward), Lincolnshire (Brown, Richardson), Wiltshire (Bailey), Schleswig-Holstein (Isted),  Nordrhein-Westfalen (Niessen).

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline suds

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 29 December 11 18:02 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for that gataki. You've made an impressive effort.

It looks good and I would be happy if it turns out that way.

suds

Offline davidbappleton

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 29 December 11 18:07 GMT (UK) »
As many = I'm not sure how many there should be??

The same as the nearest previous number; in this case, the same as the number of hedgehogs = 3.

David


Offline davidbappleton

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 29 December 11 18:13 GMT (UK) »
Az. A chev. Betw. Three hedgehogs or, on a chief ar. As many cinquefoils pierced gu. Crest - A demi lion ramp. Or, holding betw. The paws a cinquefoil pierced gu.

Azure a chevron between three hedgehogs or on a chief argent as many cinquefoils pierced gules.

On a blue shield, a gold or yellow chevron (an inverted V which extends to both sides of the shield) between three gold or yellow hedgehogs, on a white horizontal stripe filling the top of the shield three red stylized five-petaled flowers with a hole in the center (so the white of the underlying chief shows through).

A demi-lion rampant or holding between the paws a cinquefoil pierced gules.

The front half of a gold lion erect, holding in its paws a red stylized five-petaled flower with a hole in the center (as in the arms).

I've attached a couple of very rough drawings adapted from some heraldic clipart of the shield and the crest for you.

The arms are "canting", that is to say, they are a pun on the surname.  The French for "hedgehog" is "herrison", which sounds a lot like Harris.

I hope that all of this is helpful

Offline Liz_in_Sussex

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 29 December 11 18:18 GMT (UK) »
 :D

Thank you David.  That's really interesting!  :D

Liz
Research interests:
Sussex (Isted, Trusler, Pullen, Botting), Surrey (Isted), Shropshire (Hayward), Lincolnshire (Brown, Richardson), Wiltshire (Bailey), Schleswig-Holstein (Isted),  Nordrhein-Westfalen (Niessen).

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline suds

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 29 December 11 19:44 GMT (UK) »
Thank you david.

That's really interesting.

Can I take this a bit further. What would be required for someone to be awarded arms? Who would design them?

suds

Offline suds

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 29 December 11 19:49 GMT (UK) »
I've just noticed and am a bit embarrassed that I've parrotted Liz's response exactly.

All I can say is "Great minds........"

sorry

suds

Offline davidbappleton

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Re: Arms of Harris of Blackrock,Cork, Ireland
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 29 December 11 21:03 GMT (UK) »
Can I take this a bit further. What would be required for someone to be awarded arms? Who would design them?

The main requirement for someone to be granted a coat of arms is the ability to pay the necessary fees, along with a certain "eminence", which has been defined in different ways by different authorities over the years.  As a general rule, having a college degree or a commission as an officer in the military is quite sufficient.  It probably helps if you have never been convicted of a major crime.

As for who would design them, that depends entirely upon where you live.  While every heraldic authority of which I am aware pays close attention to the desires of the client in trying to get them what they desire, there are other factors in play (such as, does the design look too much like someone else's coat of arms?)  The main heraldic authorities are, in England, Wales and Northern Ireland, the College of Arms in London.  In Scotland, the Court of the Lord Lyon in Edinborough.  In Ireland, the Office of the Chief Herald in Dublin.  In Canada, the Canadian Heraldic Authority.  In South Africa, the office of the State Herald.  Most other countries do not have an heraldic authority which grants, registers, or regulates personal arms, though many countries have one or more unofficial registry bodies which will help to design coats of arms and register them for individuals.

David