*COMPLETED* Marriage to Birth years

[Ladyhawk]

The Pedigree Reports are very interesting. The one you mention is one of four I found, all for George Chesters.

Report MMQ5-RPB  (1)
Report MMS8-DVP  (2)
Report MMZS-H6W (3)
All the Pedigree Reports are submitted, not extracted.

All most confusing. Which one is correct?

The three reports above have been submitted by the same person new information has been added to the PR's so it's been updated most current being 2009

(1) dated 20 Jan 2009 - latest update so this would be most up-to-date report - this shows the added notes George marrying Army., unable to verify paternity NO record of Ann's marriage to Edward found
possible match: Edward Chester b. Chester 1813-17 - marriage cert to Margaret on file - father Thomas Chesters) (occ.Sadler) m. Margaret Ince (Father's occ. Groom) etc..... etc....
 
(2) dated 2 Sep 2008

(3) dated 6 Jul 2008

Report MMQP-1D3 has George with no parents!

This one I couldn't find 

Check if it's same person who submitted the other data & the date

He married in 1864 at Colchester where he was posted in 1858 as a soldier.

I have a copy of the marriage certificate and copies of his enlistment.

The 1861 census has him at Colchester barracks.

you have confirmation as stated above your George Chesters married and was in the Army

His father is named as Edward Chesters occ Coachman (from marriage cert)

As you stated you have George Chesters born c1836 Chester on ALL census from 1861 to 1911

Census      Address                  Occupation
1911   Providence Cottages Baddow Rd, Great Baddow, Chelmsford, Essex   Coachman
1901   29 Baddow Road, Great Baddow, Essex            Coachman, Domestic
1891   Providence Cottages, 87 Braddon Road, Great Baddow, Essex   Groom, Domestic Servant
1881   94 Moulsham Street, Chelmsford, Essex             Groom Domestic Servant
1871   Lodge House, Boxted, Rochester, Essex            Coachman and Domestic Servant
1861   Colchester Infantary Barracks               Army Private

Uncertainty for the earlier censuses 1851 & 1841

Various input from rootschatters, elzabels, AVM, dawnsh etc... some of the info. I have added below

HO107/Piece 130/Book: 16/Folio  7/Page 8
New Crane Street
John Chesters       80   M    Cheshire    Slater
Ann Chesters        35    F    Cheshire     
George     5     M   Cheshire   

at the time of George's baptism the Chesters were living at Crane Street
father named as Edward occupation desc as 'post boy' mother Ann

John CHESTERS buried Holy Trinity 07/06/1845 aged 88 of Crane Street (from elzabels)

Bapt. Chester St. Mary on the Hill  1799/04/14 Ann Chesters
Father John Occupation SLATER mother Ann - This would seem to confirm above 1841c  Ann Chesters living with her father George & her son George and on 1851c Ann Chesters unmarried HO107 Piece 2172 Folio 262 Page 2

There may be no link but interesting that there's and Edward Chesters that married 1844 Margaret Ince   he's on 1851 census HO107; Piece: 2175; Folio: 912; Page: 31 with his family his occupation is a letter carrier P.O. When George Chester's married I wonder if he only knew his father's name and had no idea about his occupation    I couldn't find any Edward Chesters with this occupation  COACHMAN on censues??? Was father Edward deceased at time of George's marriage in 1864?

[Ladyhawk]

With regards to Edward Chesters, I have three different possibilities.

Cheshire Parish records show him bn 12 Jan 1794, F Richard, M Elizabeth at Audlem

Family Search shows him bn 13 Jun 1779 F, Richard M Mary at Acton

Family Search shows him bn 14 May 1780 F Edward M Margaret also Acton.

Both the Parish records and Family Search show him marrying Ann Johnson Audlem, 7 Oct 1817

If possible you need to find whether a father's name is shown for the 1817 marriage of Edward Chesters to Ann Johnson to confirm who is father is

This appears to be Edward & Ann Chesters on the censuses 1841 - 1861 - mother in law seems to confirm this is the same couple there is NO son George born 1836 on 1841 census

1841 HO107; Piece 116; Book: 22; Civil Parish: Audlem ED 5; Folio: 11; Page: 17
Rookey Lane
Edward Chesters 45 Ag Lab. & Ann 45

1851 HO107; Piece: 2170; Folio: 338; Page: 2 (some words difficult to make out as this census very faint)
Rookey Dodcott cum Wilkesley, Audlem
Edward Chesters 50 Audlem Ag Lab
Ann 54 Wrenbury
Mary dau 32 Wrenbury ? Servant
Thomas gd/son 3 Audlem
Mary JOHNSON mother in law 94 Audlem Labourer’s widow

1861 RG9; Piece: 2622; Folio: 63; Page: 7
Rookey Dodcott cum Wilkesley, Audlem
Edward Chesters Head 65 (1796) Bricklayers Lab.
Ann wife 64 (1797)
Thomas 11 grandson
All born audlem Cheshire

It's been confirmed that George was in the Army his Army papers could be the key....they should certainly list the next of kin! At the time of attestation one would expect that to be a parent!

There is an army record at TNA WO12 4926 for George Chesters, no 500 Private  64th Foot ( Cumberland) Colchester (from elzabels)

If you are lucky George has named at least one parent as next of kin there may even be
siblings name shown

[a chesters]

This has got to be a much bigger drama than I had any idea when I first posted.

Ladyhawk re post all 4 of the pedigree reports were submitted by the same person, pyoung.

The latest report has George with all the details with which I can agree.
The mother, Ann, is shown as Ann Chesters. The notes to George state that there is no record of marriage Ann to Edward, yet I have found one in the Cheshire Parish records at Audlem, 7 Oct 1817, and also in the Bishops Transcripts, as noted in the original post.

With the info I have found, Edward was 23  and Ann 18 when married in 1817. If this info is correct, Edward would have been 42, and Ann 37 when George was born.

If the info for Edward is correct in the report, Edward was 21 at Georges birth, being born 1815, and Ann 37 born 1799, and 16 years Edwards senior!

All very confusing, and requiring more research.
I will have to find out how to get the military records for George to check for parents/siblings as you suggested in post 23

[andycand]

This has got to be a much bigger drama than I had any idea when I first posted.

Ladyhawk re post all 4 of the pedigree reports were submitted by the same person, pyoung.

The latest report has George with all the details with which I can agree.
The mother, Ann, is shown as Ann Chesters. The notes to George state that there is no record of marriage Ann to Edward, yet I have found one in the Cheshire Parish records at Audlem, 7 Oct 1817, and also in the Bishops Transcripts, as noted in the original post.

With the info I have found, Edward was 23  and Ann 18 when married in 1817. If this info is correct, Edward would have been 42, and Ann 37 when George was born.

If the info for Edward is correct in the report, Edward was 21 at Georges birth, being born 1815, and Ann 37 born 1799, and 16 years Edwards senior!

All very confusing, and requiring more research.
I will have to find out how to get the military records for George to check for parents/siblings as you suggested in post 23

Hi

I don't believe that the marriage you have found is the correct one. 

If you look at the 1841 & 1851 censuses that Ladyhawk pointed out in an earlier post Edward & Ann CHESTERS are in a different part of the county to George.

In the 1841 census Edward & Anne CHESTERS are at Dodcott-cum-Wilkesley which is near Audlem. Census Ref HO107 Piece 116 Book 22 Folio 11 Page 17

In the 1851 census Edward & Ann CHESTERS are still at Dodcott-cum-Wilkesley but also in the household is Edwards mother-in-law, Mary Johnson. This suggests that these are the Edward CHESTERS and Ann JOHNSON who married in 1817.
Census Ref HO107 Piece 2170 Folio 338 Page 2

In the 1841 census George CHESTERS is living at Chester with Ann CHESTERS 
Census Ref HO107 Piece 130 Book 16 Folio 7 Page 8

In the 1851 census George CHESTERS is living with his mother Ann CHESTERS in Chester. According to the census Ann is unmarried.
Census Ref HO107 Piece 2172 Folio 262 Page 2

I suspect that George might be illigitimate and if the 1836 baptism is him (which seems likely) then either by sheer coincidence his father was an Edward CHESTERS or Ann fibbed at the baptism.

Andy

[a chesters]

Andy,

I am beginning to agree with you, but I have a copy of the baptism register of Holy Trinity with George registered there on page 137, entry 1002, with Edward and Ann as the parents.

and to think this all started with a simple query about 19 years from marriage to birth

At this time, I will have to do a lot more work, checking all the information everyone has posted, getting printouts to go over, and probably get into more strife with OH

Thanks for all the help to everyone

[Su]

My great great grandmother had her first child in 1826 and her last (my great grandfather) in 1851.  I should imagine the menopause came as a huge relief.

One of her many children was called Every.  I thought what an unusual name, until I got to thinking that every time her husband dropped his pants the poor woman got pregnant!

[elzabels]

I suspect that George might be illigitimate and if the 1836 baptism is him (which seems likely) then either by sheer coincidence his father was an Edward CHESTERS or Ann fibbed at the baptism
Andy

There are a couple of aspects about the entry I have looked at on line,

1) Most of the other baptism entries have the actual date of birth entered, George doesn't!

2) 'his father' Edward is described as a Post BOY?

3) these are the Bishops Transcripts, a copy of the parish register entry, therefore I would prefer to see the PR / original entry in case there has been a trasnscription error! Oops Just spotted PR, same netry, BUT Also noted that the name of the officiating minister is not the usual one on the page......
so would concur that he is likely to be illegitimate

I learnt form the Parish register the fathers name of an illegitimate child, as the Officiating minister had entred it, I suppose in anticipation of a claim for Parish Relief....

[a chesters]

elzabels
With you pointing out the different minister, I noted on the parish register that the entry just above it, entry 1091 has a different officiating minister, as does entry 1086, all three being different

From a post regarding the decyphering of the occupation of Edward, in December last year, (only a month ago ) one of the replies was that:
This info came from an old occupations site.

Post Boy
1) Carried mail
2) Guard who travelled on the mail coach
3) Outrider travelling with the coach or a Postillion
so it could be an accurate description

I am extremely grateful for all the interest and information everyone has provided, and as soon as a crook knee allows me to get back to the library, I will be doing a lot more research on the commercial sites, getting printouts and copies etc of all the infomation which all of you have pointed out.

Su All I can say as a mere male, is ERRRRR um

[elzabels]

Hello

The site describing 'jobs'

http://
rmhh.co.uk/occup/p.html

There is another scenario here!

Ann takes baby George to be baptised, she gives her name as an unmarried mother, Ann CHESTERS baby's name George CHESTERS  and is then asked for the name of the father, she states Edward, the officiating minister automatically assumes his name to be Edward CHESTERS! So does Edward really exist........

He may be listed in a trade directory or Gazeteer of Chester / Cheshire as a carry of mail!