Author Topic: Princes End, Staffordshire  (Read 10070 times)

Offline Willow 4873

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #18 on: Monday 23 January 12 17:10 GMT (UK) »
Not really why should she give her age as 2-3 years older than she is on later census

Willow x
Any census information included in this post is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and is for academic and non-commercial research purposes only<br /><br />Researching: Hilton (Wolverhampton & Tamworth) , Simkiss & Mears (Wolverhampton & ?) Bowkett & Nash (Ledbury & Wolverhampton) Knight & Beard (Gloucestershire), Colley (Tibberton) Hoggins (Willenhall) Jones (Bilston), Harris & Bourne (Droitwich) Matthews (Wolverhampton & High Offley) Partridge (Monmouthshire)<br /><br /

Offline dionysus

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #19 on: Monday 23 January 12 18:06 GMT (UK) »
One consistent thing about ages in censuses is their inconsistency!  Maybe Lydia lied about her age in 1881?  Maybe the head of household didn't know and misinformed the enumerator?  Maybe the head had reason to understate her age in 1971?  If there is no credible registration of birth in 1859 then it appears 1881 is wrong and 1861 would be the best and most likely fit.
Upton, Bishops Wood, Staffordshire.  Jones, Nant-yr-Ych, Aberhafesp, Montgomeryshire.  Evans, Kinnerley, Flintshire.  Dennis, Breedon-on-the-Hill, Leicestershire.  Brown, Red Lake, Wellington, Shropshire.

Offline Wally3178

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #20 on: Monday 23 January 12 22:00 GMT (UK) »
???

In 1911, Lydia (Princes End) is married to John Gibson?

Where does Ernest fit into the picture?
  Ernest is the son of John and Lydia and was born and, I believe, registered as Ernest Fellows.   The oral family history has it that Ernest was formally adopted by John just before he married Ann Ethel Anderson.   I have no idea why he waited so long, its one of the mysteries I am trying to solve.

Wal

Offline Wally3178

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #21 on: Monday 23 January 12 22:06 GMT (UK) »
Here is a sketch of how I see it.

I know the Black Country pretty well, so please aks about local geography - though little remains that they would recognise.

Good hunting!

G'day dionysus,

Why did you call it 'The Black Country'?   Your flowchart looks pretty accurate to me  :D

cheers

Wal

Wal


Offline dionysus

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #22 on: Monday 23 January 12 22:51 GMT (UK) »
Princes End is in an area that was the heartland of metal working industries during Victorian times, characterised by coal mines, slag heaps, blast furnaces, foundries, casting works and so on, with smoke-blackened buildings and chimneys belching all kinds of fumes from horizon to horizon.  Apocryphally, the term Black Country was coined by Queen Victoria when passing through by train, but there is some evidence that the name is older and refers to shallow or outcropping coal deposits.  Anyway, the name stuck and, although there is no clearly defined boundary, the area between Wolverhampton, Walsall, West Bromwich and Stourbridge is generally referred to as the Black Country today.  Back in the 1860s and 70s it was a grim place to exist, with very low life expectancy, heavy pollution, crashing industrial sounds (even in the early 1980s I stood outside just one factory where the violent thud of presses made the ground shake so that I felt lifted off my feet, and this would have been going on night and day all around).  Today there are still places that have not been redeveloped because the contamination is so severe and costly to remediate - I worked on an old power station site where it took 20 months and £16 million just to get the ground in a fit state to build on.

People have suggested renaming the area, but how do you overcome:  where?;  the Black Country; oh there, why didn't you say?

Anyway, hope that clarifies it a bit.
Upton, Bishops Wood, Staffordshire.  Jones, Nant-yr-Ych, Aberhafesp, Montgomeryshire.  Evans, Kinnerley, Flintshire.  Dennis, Breedon-on-the-Hill, Leicestershire.  Brown, Red Lake, Wellington, Shropshire.

Offline Wally3178

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #23 on: Tuesday 24 January 12 00:20 GMT (UK) »
Okay everyone, I think I've got this finally sorted! I didn't think the Lydia Fellows on '71 census born Willenhall was the right one but it was bugging me that I couldn't find another Lydia Fellows for that same census with the right fit. Bingo! Finally found her on the 1871 Census for Sedgely RG10 3006 172 29 but her name was transcribed wrongly as LEARA FELLOWS. She is a domestic servant aged 9, born Sedgley and living with and this is another transcription error, SIMON JANE and family but should read SIMON PAUL. This is the same family that Lydia Fellows is living with in the 1881 census, 
RG11 2871 48 2 is still their servant, but this time says she is from Princes End.

So from this we can conclude we won't find her on the 1861 census as she wasn't born yet and her correct birth is
Dec 1861 Dudley 6c 41. Wal, you will have to order this certificate if you want to find out who her parents are, depends how far you want to go back. Trust  everyone agrees with my conclusion?
Deb

Hi Deborah G,

Thank you for your time and effort it is all good data and will go a long way toward solving the 'Lydia' mystery.   I am ordering Lydia's Birth Certificate and also Emmaline's as suggested by Willow.

Thanks again everyone, you have made this old man's day.  

Cheers,

Wal

Offline Wally3178

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #24 on: Tuesday 24 January 12 00:28 GMT (UK) »
Princes End is in an area that was the heartland of metal working industries during Victorian times...........

dionysus,

Good stuff mate, thanks.   I'll paraphrase it and use it in Lydia's notes and I'm getting my grandsons to do some Googling to see if they can find some old photographs and some more anecdotal stuff about life there at the time.   When you think about it, life must have been bloody hard for those workers and the income meagre.

Thanks again,

Wal

Offline Willow 4873

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 25 January 12 10:40 GMT (UK) »
One consistent thing about ages in censuses is their inconsistency!  Maybe Lydia lied about her age in 1881?  Maybe the head of household didn't know and misinformed the enumerator?  Maybe the head had reason to understate her age in 1971?  If there is no credible registration of birth in 1859 then it appears 1881 is wrong and 1861 would be the best and most likely fit.

Actually I usually find ancestors are pretty good at remembering their ages on census

Lets us know what the certificates say Wal when you get them

Willow x
Any census information included in this post is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and is for academic and non-commercial research purposes only<br /><br />Researching: Hilton (Wolverhampton & Tamworth) , Simkiss & Mears (Wolverhampton & ?) Bowkett & Nash (Ledbury & Wolverhampton) Knight & Beard (Gloucestershire), Colley (Tibberton) Hoggins (Willenhall) Jones (Bilston), Harris & Bourne (Droitwich) Matthews (Wolverhampton & High Offley) Partridge (Monmouthshire)<br /><br /

Offline Wally3178

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Re: Princes End, Staffordshire
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 25 January 12 11:35 GMT (UK) »


Actually I usually find ancestors are pretty good at remembering their ages on census

Lets us know what the certificates say Wal when you get them

Willow x
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No problem Willow, Birth Certificate ordered today and I will post a copy for all to see.

Cheers,

Wal