Mawby - Long Lawford. A puzzle! *COMPLETED*

[behindthefrogs]

Going back to the original posting.  Does anyone have any more details of the William Mawby who married Elizabeth Matthews.

I am particularly interested in the names of his parents, his date of birth/baptism and the precise date and place of William and Elizabeth's marriage.  Is anything known about his occupation?

David

[behindthefrogs]

Does this family fit in with this line?

Thomas Webb bapt 23 Jun 1811 Newbold on Avon.  An Agricultural Labourer who married Sarah Clarke at Brinklow 1 29 Nov 1830.  (She was born at Brinklow c1812)  They lived in Long Lawford in 1841 In 1851 and 1861 he was an agricultural labourer living in Long Lawford but by 1871 he was a labourer at the lime works.  In 1881 they were both lime burners living in Long Lawford.  He died Q3 1884 age 76 and she died Q4 1886 age 76. Children:

  William Webb bapt Newbold on Avon 30 Oct 1831
  Betsey Webb bapt 15 Sep 1833 Long Lawford married (1) 13 Mar 1854 in Newbold on Avon to Joseph Matthews (2) John Round 11 Feb 1868 and they had 6 more children  She died in Long Lawford in 1893
  Thomas Webb bapt 6 Mar 1836 Newbold on Avon.  He died Q1 1839 Rugby D.
  Thomas Webb born 1843 Long Lawford

Joseph Matthews who was the first husband of Betsy Webb was the son of William Matthews and Bathsheba Drakely

[Slipper]

Hi David

William Mawby married Elizabeth Matthews at Newbold 21.2.1814.  The marriage was witnessed by John Matthews.  William was able to sign his name.  I know nothing about William's ancestors or where he was born.  At the marriage he was 'of this parish'.  On the death certificate of Elizabeth, she was described as 'widow of William Mawby, labourer'.  I have sometimes wondered if his family were non-conformist.  My grandfather (his g grandson) was baptist and his son, William, married Susannah Hay (nee Bicknell) whose father I believe was a non-conformist minister.  As William died in 1829 we have scant information about him.  If you discover anything, I would love to know.

I don't know about Sarah Clarke of Brinklow but if I find anything I'll let you know.

Slipper

[Slipper]

Hi Z

You do have the most interesting finds and I don't know how you manage to read the 1851 census for Long Lawford which I find almost totally illegible on Ancestry.  Incidentally, on the marriage cert. of William Burton & Sarah Clark could you understand what William signed after his name - was it 'Junior'?

What you suggest about the Mawby - Clarke connection is quite possible.  I keep going back to the 1861 census where we discover that Ellen's mother is Mary Batchelor and from there go to Mary Clarke and Joseph Batchelor.  It is quite possible that Mary Mawby abandoned her child, Ellen, who was then befriended by Mary Batchelor nee Clarke.

Your find on Elizabeth Clarke & George Payne is interesting - right age, pity about the father. ( I wonder if they had common law marriages then when the woman took the mans name even though they weren't legally married.  If this were so, then Sarah might never have been a Clarke at all - or dare we not contemplate this.)  The only thing that worries me is that  John Frederick Payne was born 10 years after John Frederick Clarke and 2 years before Elizabeth and George were married.  Does naming 2 children born out of wedlock the same name seem a touch lacking in originality?  Maybe she just liked the names.

Slipper

[z]

Hi Slipper

My apologies if I have misunderstood your reply but I am not suggesting that Mary abandoned her daughter Ellen but Mary herself was possibily illegitimate/abandoned and that Elizabeth Mawby took her in and hence Mary Clarke took on the surname of Mawby, she baptised her son Frederick in her true name of Clarke but he was shown in the census as Frederick Mawby, after his death she then baptised her daughter Ellen as a Mawby, perhaps Mary who was working away and as a single unmarried mother believed that if anything happened to her then maybe she might secure her daughters future by giving her the Mawby surname, making life a little easier, she then married Joseph Batchelor in her true name of Clarke, her fathers name of Thomas Clarke on the marriage certificate was possibly fabricated to hide the fact that she was actually illegitimate. And the same for Elizabeth Clarke and George Payne, if she was the daughter of Sarah Burton and born before she married William Burton maybe she too wanted to hide the fact that she was illegitimate and even though she gives her fathers name as William Clarke it was not uncommon for individuals to fabricate a name , usually with their mothers maiden name, or they would name their grandfather or even an uncle as their father.

And just to clarify John Frederick Clarke son of Elizabeth Clarke was baptised in 1851 and the John Frederick Payne found in 1871 with George and Elizabeth was 19 -  I think he is the same boy.

Sorry but I am not sure what William signed next to his name -  it could be Junior? Maybe you might consider  attaching that particular section on the deciphering board so that another rootschatter will be able to help

Again, my apologies if I was unclear I have thought about so many scenarios in order to explain a possible reason for the interchangeable name of Mawby and Clarke and this is only conjecture but I think that Mary Clarke and Mary Mawby are the same person.

All the very best Slipper

Z  

[Slipper]

Good morning Z

Forgive my addled brain re John Frederick - I had written down his DoB as 10 years earlier then it was.  I am sure you are right that they are the same family.

Regards Mary Mawby, I had understood your theory and was just adding another possibility which would allow for Mary Mawby and Mary Clarke being two different people.  I rather think that unless the birth certificate for Ellen Elizabeth Clarke comes up with any treasures or I discover more about William Mawby's family then we are unlikely to discover the truth.  Anyway, the journey is often more interesting than reaching the destination and I haven't quite given up yet.

Slipper

[Slipper]

Hello Jim and Z

You were both right - Mary Clarke and Mary Mawby were the same person!  I have received the birth certificate for Ellen Elizabeth Clarke born 26.1.1844.  She was born in Long Lawford and her mother was Mary Clarke.  Her father was John Edwards who was an inspector of carriages at Rugby railway station!

I am very grateful for your help.  I would never have got there without your research and inspiration.

Thanks

Slipper

[jim1]

A bit of a rarity having the father's name,usually that bit's left blank.

jim

[wyrleybart]

Fascinating thread, and I am sorry this doesn't contribute at all but..... I recall a Gordon Mawby as a train driver based at Rugby in the 1990s. I think he had been divorced and remarried a Phillipine bride.

The railway servant link between Gordon and this thread was what interested me.