Author Topic: Ships in 1840's  (Read 2538 times)

Offline jaypee

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Ships in 1840's
« on: Monday 06 August 12 19:44 BST (UK) »
As a result of a previous post I have information on the various ships a person I am researching sailed on. As an apprentice he sailed with The Alpha, (registered in Whitby?) for 6 years from 1843 to 1849. During that time a ship called The Alpha sailed to Tasmania and I have found some information from newspapers etc giving dates etc of arrival at ports between 1843 and 1849. However other information I have showing what I believe to be Port numbers does not tie up with the fact that the Alpha was in Australia during those years.

As you can tell I am not used to deciphering mariners information. How can I determine whether the The Alpha that sailed to Australia was in fact the one William Richardson was travelling on.

Can anyone help me please

Offline seaweed

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 07 August 12 12:55 BST (UK) »
There were several ships around in the timescale named ALPHA. Are you 100% that the ship your ancestor was an apprentice on, was registered in Whitby?
If so all the information I can find is she made one voyage to Quebec in that time and others to the Baltic ports. That is not to say she did not sail to Australia but I would have thought it would have been recorded.
Her logbooks would give us the answer but it seems they have been lost or destroyed.
Her crew agrements may still survive and these may give soom clues, it would also prove if your ancestor was onboard.
To obtain this information you would need to visit the National Archive at Kew and view the records in piece's BT98/517 BT98/819 BT(98/1117 BT98/1460 BT98/1791 BT98/2074

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATLN=3&CATID=1569&SearchInit=4&SearchType=6&CATREF=BT98

Could you attach the documents with the "port numbers"
Dim ateb yn well nag ateb anghywir. Nid oes dim yn ddall fel rhai nad ydynt yn dymuno gweld

RIP Roger 10 August 2022

Offline jaypee

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 07 August 12 16:43 BST (UK) »
According to the List of Testimonials and Statements of Service I received from the Maritime Museum with William Richardsons certificates, the Alpha was registered in Whitby. William served on the ship as an apprentice from Jan 1843 to Jan 1849.

The document that lists the port numbers was sent to me but I have just tried to attach it to a post and I had a message saying it was too big to send. The form has a box on the side, rather like a census return with BT 113/44. The journeys covered are from 1845 to 1848. Port numbers in each year include 238 (which is included in a batch of numbers where the port names are missing) and 104 which I believe is Whitby. William is listed on the form under number 87070, his Master Mariners certificate is C6595 and it was issued in Sunderland. Hope this information helps.

Offline seaweed

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 07 August 12 18:58 BST (UK) »
Without seeing the document with the port numbers it's impossible to give a meaningful interpretation.  104 is the port number for Whitby.
The port number 238 was never issued. Port numbers for Australian ports were
Sydney NSW 207. Hobart Tasmania 208. Launceston Tasmania 211. Melbourne 263. Freemantle 280. Geelong 294.
The Master of ALPHA was C Scurra. An unusul surname. I did a search of newspapers using the word "Scurra " Only one meaningfull reply from the Hull Packet and East Riding Times of July 20 1849 Saying " The ALPHA Scurra sailed Quebec on the 16th July bound for Whitby.
I should have thought a voyage to Australia would have warrented a word in the local press.
Without looking at the crew agreements in BT98, my feeling is the  ALPHA of Whitby never sailed to Australia.
Dim ateb yn well nag ateb anghywir. Nid oes dim yn ddall fel rhai nad ydynt yn dymuno gweld

RIP Roger 10 August 2022


Offline jaypee

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 07 August 12 21:16 BST (UK) »
The document was sent to me by Gaie on RootsChat in April this year. It was a topic I started and both you and Gaie helped me. Maybe you can see it there. The Topic was Master Mariner.

Offline seaweed

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 07 August 12 21:37 BST (UK) »
OK Sorry. I answer that many queries its hard to remember all of the posts.
I looked at the seamans ticket and there is nothing to suggest that there was a voyage to Australia just short time voyages out and home Whitby.
The number 238 is the Port of Rotation number.  No key to port of rotation numbers has been found and there is no common thought on their meaning. Personally I think they refer to a certain vessel in a particular port but like I say just theory.
Dim ateb yn well nag ateb anghywir. Nid oes dim yn ddall fel rhai nad ydynt yn dymuno gweld

RIP Roger 10 August 2022

Offline jaypee

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 08 August 12 09:03 BST (UK) »
Thank you. I really do appreciate the help you have given me.

Offline Kero

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #7 on: Friday 05 June 15 12:21 BST (UK) »
I realise that this is an old thread, but wanted to offer an update.  The Alpha, a 242 ton brig, sailed out of Whitby between 1840 [when it was launched] and 1850 when it went down with all hands off the island of Hogland [aka Gogland] in the Gulf of Finland.  My great great grandfather, Christopher Scorra [aka Scurra/Scurrah], was the captain.  The Alpha sailed with coal as far afield as St Petersburg, Montreal and Marseille, and brought back timber from Scandinavia and Canada. The ship did not travel to Australia.  Christopher Scorra's eldest son was also a seaman and I believe that he was with his father on the ship when it was lost, but do not have the evidence for that.

Offline Kero

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Re: Ships in 1840's
« Reply #8 on: Friday 05 June 15 12:25 BST (UK) »
I should have mentioned that I do have a painting of the Alpha if that is of interest to anyone.