1873 Discharge records 59th Foot Regiment

[maggbill]

Another attempt at one of my old "brick walls".  Have obtained military discharge records (1873) for Michael Kenny  (Private, 59th regiment of Foot.,  Regimental No. 3601) from FindMyPast.    Unfortunately records give no indication of family or marriage status.  Am trying to prove that this is husband of my ancestor Jane McNab, who dies in Glasgow Scotland in 1872.  When searching FindMyPast there were about 15 "Michael Kenny's" who could have been of appropriate age - filtering them with "59th Foot" produced "0 results" - but this No. 3601 does in fact state he was with 59th Foot.  It just doesn't supply me with any verification that he could have been married to my Jane (though her Glasgow death entry states she is married to  Michael Kenney, 59th Foot Reg.)  And they had a 5 year old daughter, Mary,  when Jane the mother dies - who disappears completely.  Jane's death entry is the only Scottish record - no birth for Mary, no marriage for Michael and Jane, no death for Michael or the child Mary.

Michael states that he is aiming to return to live in Limerick.  Any ideas anyone where I could find further traces of Michael or the child?  Or proof that this Michael is in fact the man I am looking for?

[Tyrannosaurus]

If they met while the regiment was stationed in Glasgow, it's quite possible the marriage and birth of child took place in Ireland after the regiment moved there. The first 6 months in Ireland they were headquartered at Birr, and then moved to Athlone, with maybe the final couple of months at Curragh.

These are the approximate dates of movements of the 59th Foot after leaving South Africa in 1862.

Jan 1862 to Dover
Jun 1863 to Aldershot
Mar 1865 to Glasgow
Jan 1866 to Ireland
Nov 1867 to Ceylon
Jun 1869 to India, where they stayed for many years.

When the 59th Foot arrived in Glasgow, in March 1865, it was in the troop-ship Himalaya. It carried 23 officers, 783 men, 103 soldier’s wives, 102 soldier’s children, 7 horses, and the heavy baggage of the regiment.

Rex

[maggbill]

thanks for this information Rex.  On studying it, i am thinking that Michael and Jane met in Glasgow - married in Ireland and had the child Mary maybe in Athlone.  I wonder if Michael then went to Ceylon and India alone, - he was discharged from Burnley in 1873 - so that would be interesting to find out why he was back in England in 1873 when you say the regiment stayed in India from 1869 onwards.  I must try to sort out the timeline and re-read his discharge papers.  Find little snippets of info each time I read them!!

Can you tell me where you found such detailled info on this regiment - e.g. the troop ship Himalaya etc.. 
thanks again

[km1971]

He would have been sent back from India to be discharged. The Depot was in Burnley in 1873.

Ken

[Tyrannosaurus]

The troopship item was from the Glasgow Herald, March 6, 1865. (bottom of the Greenock column).
http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=Vk1EAAAAIBAJ&sjid=s7EMAAAAIBAJ&pg=3255%2C3082901

The movements were from Stations of the British Army, published monthly in the newspapers, and usually taken from the United Service Magazine or similar. You can get less detailed info on movements from pre 2008 snapshots of regiments.org via the Wayback Machine at the Internet Archive. Some material can also be found, somewhat buried, on this site. http://cgsc.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p4013coll11/id/1277

Rex

Here’s a regiments.org snapshot from October 2007. Hope it works.
http://web.archive.org/web/20071011003104/http://www.regiments.org/regiments/index.htm

Rex

[maggbill]

thanks for the information - Rex and Ken.  It is all adding up to a fascinating story.  never thought I could get so interested in Military history.  And great article from Glasgow Herald.  Now i have to figure out how to do "searches" for the Archived Herald - never seems to work too well for me.

Lots to study and figure out - better get to bed - start afresh tomorrow.

Cheers!

[zeebra]

Hello Maggbill,
My Gr. Grandfather was in the 59th Foot and was discharged in 1869. I was able to find his location, from discharge to marriage (1876), through pension records. Pension records show where the payment was paid. If Michael Kenney qualified for a pension you may have some luck that way. ( I must add that I was at the National Archive in Kew when I did this research, but I would imagine there is some kind of online access now)

Good Luck
Bill

[maggbill]

Hi Zeebra - Bill,

Thanks very much for the helpful comments - Through FindMyPast I have managed to get the 4 page discharge summary of my soldier Michael Kenny in 1873.  It would however appear that this is the only record online at least through FindMyPast.  I am afraid that I struggle each and every time I try to use the online records National Archives  Kew  - find it so confusing. 

So - I understand that u found your solider's pension records at Kew - not online.   Can you tell me - are these "Pension" records separate from the discharge papers? (Certainly the 4 page discharge I have, calculates the exact time spent in service - but gives no indication at all to a pension, or where it would be paid.  Michael states that he intends to return to Limerick, his place of birth.  But no indication of where a pension was actually paid.  With another of my "brick walls" - I had another soldier discharged in 1876, who told the Army that he intended to return to Scotland - but could never find him thereafter in Scotland - eventually think i have found him 13 years later in a second marriage in Ontario in Canada!!

Would be delighted if you or anyone else could advise if actual "Pension" records would be available somewhere (?online) - i.e. separate from the discharge papers.?? 

[zeebra]

Hello Maggbill,
The documents at Kew are kept under separate reference numbers, with the discharge records of many soldiers in one file. Thankfully they were mostly in alphabetical order.
When I viewed my Gr.Grandfather's documents his discharge hearing also considered whether he was entitled to a pension on health grounds. Inside the discharge papers was the actual document which was completed when he joined up, it gave his height, colour of eyes and hair and his parents names. However this was only a small document and seemed to be missing from the discharge papers of other soldiers in the same file.
His discharge papers showed where he intended to live (Hamilton, Scotland). When I got his Pension records they showed that he was in Belfast by March 1870 and back in Glasgow by September 1871. The pension records were part of a large book which where the payment was to be made.
I live in Scotland and had to make two trips to the National Archive at Kew over a 4 year span. I don't know where you live but if it is feasible to go, make the effort. It's fascinating to get to inspect the actual documents. When I was there they did not charge for admission ore viewing.
Hope you eventually find what you are looking for.

Bill