Author Topic: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)  (Read 12030 times)

Offline estiman

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 552
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
I am trying to get information on the origins of John Carroll (Carole).  The earliest reference I have is his marriage, age 22, to Elizabeth Boyle in 1860 in St Olave, Bermondsey.  He gives his father’s name as Jeremiah Carroll, labourer. His residence is Foxlow St, St Olave, Bermondsey. Elizabeth is in 8 Anthony Street, St Olave. In the 1861 census they are both in 8 Anthony Street.

From then onwards I have references in censuses up to 1891.  His date of birth varies (calculated from age) but mainly around 1836-38. 1871 census would give 1841 and probable (?) death in 1895, St Olave, gives age 52 (= 1843). He consistently gives birthplace as Kerry (or once Co Kerry – 1871). In 1861 he lives in Anthony Street (as John Carole, with Betty), which has a high concentration of Irish from Kerry. Next door at no. 7 there is a William Carroll, age 48 from Kerry, with wife, Bridget & son John.

He is always listed as “labourer” or, once, “corn porter”. And his first son is named as Jeremiah (probably born 1862).

The only other things I have found are a reference to the marriage of a Jeremiah Carroll to a Mary Ward in 1828, but in the Diocese of Cork & Ross, Co Cork.  There is a possible birth of Jeremiah Carroll in 1808, in Boherbue, Co Cork, which is just across the boundary from Kerry.

Any suggestions on how I can proceed?

PS just seen the link to www.irishgenealogy.ie.  Had a quick look but would still like other suggestions/ insight or (even better) some-one with same interest

Offline shanew147

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 16,777
  • Dublin, Ireland
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 11 November 12 18:35 GMT (UK) »
....
PS just seen the link to www.irishgenealogy.ie.  Had a quick look but would still like other suggestions/ insight or (even better) some-one with same interest

The IrishGenealogy website is definitely the best place to search for that area.

They have nearly all the available RC and CofI records for Co. Kerry, and many for south-west Co. Cork.

not sure if you are new to Irish records, but will post these RootsChat resource links just in case :

   Introduction to Irish Records
   My Ancestor came from Ireland - where do I start?



Shane
Remember to check the Resource boards :  Ireland, Dublin, Antrim & Cork (and stickies at the top of other county sub-forums)    
My Surname Interests

Offline estiman

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 552
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 11 November 12 19:18 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Shane. Yes I am new to Irish records.  I have 2 branches from Ireland:

1.  John Carroll (father Jeremiah) + spouse Elizabeth Boyle (father John) Kerry/ Cork

2. Peter Corridan (father Timothy) + spouse Elizabeth Sullivan (father James) Kerry/ Cork

The two come together in marriage in 1890 (Bermondsey, London)

I think I had been putting off tackling the Irish records as I had relatively little to go on and don't know my way around the records.  To make matters worse, my ancestors seem to have been playing a game with the census recorders ;D.  Their dates of birth (calculated from ages) can vary by up to 10 years and they change their minds whether they were born in Co Kerry or Co Cork.

Thanks for the links, I'll have a look,

Ray

Offline shanew147

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 16,777
  • Dublin, Ireland
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 11 November 12 19:24 GMT (UK) »
Is  St Olave's, Bermondsey Church of England ?

If so, you might need to consider Church of Ireland records - it's the equivalent Anglican denomination In Ireland.

Unfortunately the IrishGenealogy website doesn't include any CofI records for West Cork.



Shane
Remember to check the Resource boards :  Ireland, Dublin, Antrim & Cork (and stickies at the top of other county sub-forums)    
My Surname Interests


Offline Dulaigh

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 166
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 11 November 12 20:19 GMT (UK) »
Irish census 1901/11 ages are usually incorrect locally speaking. Jeremiah Carrol or Carol was one of two primary names in Kerry/Cork border. See Cappaphaudeen in KILMEEN in GRIFFITHS. CAPPAGHPHANDEEN , Tooreenfineen in CLONFERT WEST 1901 also CAPPAGHPHAUDEEN in 1911 census. Possibles.

Offline estiman

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 552
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 11 November 12 22:43 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Shane & Dulaigh.

The census records I have are from London, post 1861.  I've not yet looked at any Irish ones.

St Olave was the registration district as well as the church, which is Church of England.  The Carrolls were catholics, which has posed a problem - baptism records are not easily available & I haven't found them online. Most of their birth references are recorded and available on FreeBMD. But the only way to check and see details is by ordering the original certificate & paying. Would be very expensive if you have several contenders.  Two of the Carrolls, my direct ancestors, do not even appear in the official records at the GRO.

Just my luck that Jeremiah Car(r)ol was so common!

Ray

Offline gangamonk

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 8
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 23 January 13 05:12 GMT (UK) »
Hello, My grandfather was Roger Carroll at this address in Foxglove.  You could be the answer to my prayers.  In the family was Timothy and also Elizabeth and Corridan (though they started to use Corrigan instead). Can you please email me.  I have been searching for my roots for so long.  My grandfather refused to speak of his family.

Offline gangamonk

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 8
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 23 January 13 05:13 GMT (UK) »
Hi, I forgot also he died at St Olaves also.

Offline estiman

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 552
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: John Carroll, father Jeremiah – where born in Kerry (moved to London Bermondsey)
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 23 January 13 11:49 GMT (UK) »
Hi, I may disappoint.  My Roger Carroll married Mary Corridan in Dec 1890, address Salisbury Place Bermondsey. Father John Carroll, who married Elizabeth Boyle in 1860, living Foxlow Street (him). John died (Mar) 1895 St Olave 1d 226, Elizabeth (Jun) 1894 St Saviour 1d 31. I have not ordered these death certificates and so have not confirmed, but I am reasonable sure they are correct.  If any of this computes, let me know & I'll try to give you more info. (PM sent also)