Author Topic: Carnmoney Cemeteries  (Read 3256 times)

Offline fadge36

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Carnmoney Cemeteries
« on: Tuesday 01 January 13 18:34 GMT (UK) »
Requests for information on burials in Carnmoney cemetery crop up regularly in the forum and I feel there is a need to clarify the fact that there are 7 Graveyards involved. (See Attached Plan)
Carnmoney cemetery Main, Cemetery East and East extensions are controlled by Newtownabbey Borough Council and they will hold the records of burials.
Carnmoney Parish Church has 3 graveyards. As the result of stirling work by NIFHS the graves surrounding the Church have been catalogued in the booklet "Carved in Stone", now believed out of print but available in CD form. Graveyard B is also catalogued in "The Hidden Graveyard".  A Graveyard C booklet is I believe(and I hope) in the course of preparation.
The Jewish graveyard is adjacent to the Hidden graveyard.
The Plan shows the extent of the Cemeteries being about halt a mile across.
Even when Grave register numbers are available it can prove difficult to decide which graveyard is involved. I hope this is helpful.
fadge36

Offline Puddleduck03

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 08 April 21 11:03 BST (UK) »
Thanks for this fadge36.  Which one is known as Carnmoney Burial Ground please?  Looking a grave from 1904/5. Many thanks.
Puddleduck03

Offline Kiltaglassan

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #2 on: Friday 09 April 21 15:03 BST (UK) »

Fadge36 was last online here in November 2016.

Due to district council re-organisation the Carnmoney cemeteries are now under the responsibility of Antrim and Newtownabbey Borough Council for the general management, regulation and control of each cemetery.
See- https://antrimandnewtownabbey.gov.uk/residents/cemeteries/


KG

Researching: Cuthbertson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Australia; Hunter – Co. Derry; Jackson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Canada; Scott – Co. Derry; Neilly – Co. Antrim & USA; McCurdy – Co. Antrim; Nixon – Co. Cavan, Co. Donegal, Canada & USA; Ryan & Noble – Co. Sligo


Offline emcquiston

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 16 June 21 19:51 BST (UK) »
hi.

i was looking some help. im looking for the grave of my great grandfather and great great grandfather buried together, last 1 to be buried was in 1953.
From information already given i understand that they are buried in the hidden graveyard, a transcription describes the grave as a tall headstone with metal railings.
The information suggests that the plot is a/e 38?????
i went today to look for the grave,  that was the 1st time me and my sister had been so getting our bearing we started off at the grave in the parish church grounds, then realised that the hidden graveyard is directly across the road we tried there, now i no the graveyard is in poor conditon but we had a good search and couldnt find a thing.
does anyone no does the hidden graveyard even have a section in it a/e????
any info would be fantastic.

ive emailed newtownabbey council, who emailed to say that the hidden graveyard belongs to the parish church and gave me the name of the minister there .

Offline emcquiston

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 16 June 21 19:53 BST (UK) »
sorry i forgot to add that the names in the grave is James Pritchard, thomas edward pritchard 1953 and isabella gamble, poss an ellen too.

Offline Jon_ni

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #5 on: Friday 18 June 21 12:44 BST (UK) »
The Parish cemetery sections were transcribed by NIFHS in 3 booklets / CD’s outlined here https://carnmoney.connor.anglican.org/publications.html as available from NIFHS https://www.nifhs.org/product/the-carnmoney-three-in-one-set/ I'v not got a copy myself but suggests thare are accompaning reference maps etc
Info from https://www.facebook.com/NewtownabbeyFHS/photos/?tab=album&album_id=434807953343576

Offline TheWhuttle

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #6 on: Monday 21 June 21 21:18 BST (UK) »
Hi emcquiston,

We've got a copy of  the book here:

THE HIDDEN GRAVEYARD
CARNMONEY PARISH CHURCH
ISBN 978-0-9561374-0-1

MEMORIALS IN GRAVEYARD No.1
Recorded & Published by Members of the Newtownabbey Branch
of the North of Ireland Family History Society.
pps. 144 total.

[Seen those folks in action many times, dedicated industrious skilled people.
 The book is a power of work, a MUST HAVE for those interested in genealogical connections to the area.
 Lots of history, photos, memorial listings for WWI & WWII participants, maps, indexes of surnames & placenames, etc.
 'Tis a wonder to behold!]

The "hidden" graveyard is indeed located immediately (South) across Church Road from the church.
[So called 'cos it was totally overgrown for years, some parts being impenetrable.
 Graves are meant to be maintained by surviving family, but these drift away and perish themselves.
 A number of years ago the Council stepped in and blitzed the whole place with "Agent Orange".
 I thought that I had entered a war zone!]

----

pps 17-25 contain an alphabetical list of all surnames that could be transcribed ​from the memorial stones.
[N.B. Some plots had no memorials, either originally or they were "lost" to posterity.
      Others were unreadable because of weathering or damage.
      Others had fallen over (dangerous to explore, even for experienced speliologists).]

p.21  Lists two PRITCHARD grave references -  E/A38 (p.85)  &  J/B12  (p.114).


----
p.26 Shows the layout map for the SECTIONs within the "Hidden" (aka No.1) graveyard.

Stand at the entrance (on the South side of Church Road).
Looking South (straight down), then scan from right (West) to left (East).

The SECTIONs ("ground blocks") are arranged roughly in horizontal rows, labelled:

"A" near the entrance at the top;
"B", "C", "D", "E" & "F" (which latter runs right down to the bottom);
"G" (situate East of "B", and South  of "C", "D" & "E";
"H", "J", "K", "L";
"M" (right at the bottom.).

[There is no "I".
 Perhaps, Theologically, it was deemed inappropriate to use Jesus' initial in a graveyard context?
    ("I" in Latin, as in the derogatory "INRI".)
 More prosaically, Typographically, to avoid a character that could be confused with the numeric digit "1".
   So, e.g. a reference of J/I12 might cause folks to waste time looking for grave 112 in instead of 12.]

----

p.26
To get to SECTION "E" simply follow the short path down through SECTION "A" to the cross-roads.
Turn left (East) past the top of SECTION "D", which lies on the right (South).
You will pass (what looks like) a wall
  (deduced from the solid black line running N-S on the map).
SECTION "E" now lies on your right (South), stretching along to the corner of the path.

p.77

SECTION "E" is split simply in to 5-off vertical columns
  [Each designated by a non-numeric alphabetic character]:

Column "A" (graves A1-A58; First visible memorial A1 McILVEEN)
Column "B" (graves B1-B54; First visible memorial B1 REILLY)
Column "C" (graves C1-C58; First visible memorial C1 TINSLEY)
Column "D" (graves D1-D50; First visible memorial D3 HARKNESS)
Column "E" (graves E1-E49; First visible memorial E1 HUNT)

Your interest will be in Column "A".
 [The 1st (most-Western) one that you will encounter, immediately next to the "wall".]
The grave reference "E/A38" means SECTION "E" - Column "A" - Grave "38".


Now some "Maths":  38 (yours) / 58 (last) ~ 40/60 = 2/3.
So the grave is located ~2/3 down (South) from the top;
[N.B This is a guesstimate.
 Some graves are "longer" than others, especially large family graves.]


You could either:

1) walk down along the "wall" (if that is indeed what it is)  [Not advised!];

2) tiptoe down along the left (East) side of the "wall" through/past the other 37 graves;

3) walk further East along the path to the corner,
     turn right (South) and walk 2/3 down the path
       (such running down the Eastern side of SECTION "E"),
     turn right (West) and then tiptoe through fewer (viz. 4) graves (Columns E,D,C,B).

4) for geographical guidance, if standing on the Eastern path of SECTION "E",
     look Westward in the immediate Column "E" (and then over to Column "A") for
     E/E23 (STEELE, Stone no Surround),
     E/E26 (MAGILL, Tall black stone.),
     E/E38 (WILSON, Stone and Surround 1895).

5) in this case you need to be looking for a tall stone with metal railings
      E/A38 (PRITCHARD) in this furthest (Western-most) column, next the "wall".
     [E/A42 (MILLAR, metal plaque with railings) lies closeby North of it.]


[N.B. There appears to be no (offical) path along the bottom of SECTION "E".]


The surnames present on the memorials are listed alphabetically in the book.
[For SECTION "E" they cover pps. 77-88
 There are 3 fallen stones.]

(to be continued next)
WHITTLEY - Donegore, Ballycraigy, Newtownards, Guernsey, PALI
WHITTLE - Dublin, Glenavy, Muckamore, Belfast; Jamaica; Norfolk (Virginia), Baltimore (Maryland), New York
CHAINE - Ballymena, Muckamore, Larne
EWART, DEWART - Portglenone, Ballyclare
McAFEE, WALKER - Ballyrashane

"You can't give kindness away enough, it keeps coming back to you."
Mark Twain (aka Samuel CLEMENTS) [Family origins from Ballynure, Co. Antrim.]

Offline TheWhuttle

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #7 on: Monday 21 June 21 21:26 BST (UK) »
(continued from immediate previous post)

--------

p.26

To get to SECTION "J" simply follow the short path down through SECTION "A" to the cross-roads.

Go straight across.
 [SECTION "C" lies to the right (West);
  SECTION "D" lies to the left (East).]

When you get to the T-junction turn right (West).
  [SECTION "G" lies to your left (South).]

Turn left (South) at the first path (before you get to the corner).
  [SECTION "B" lies to your right (West); SECTION "G" lies to your left (East).]

When you get to the T-junction turn right (West).
After a few yards SECTION "J" lies on the left (South).


p.106

SECTION "J" is split simply in to 9-off vertical columns:

Column "A" (graves A1-A25; First visible memorial A1 BOYCE)
Column "B" (graves B1-B28; First visible memorial B4 WATTERS)
Column "C" (graves C1-C25; First visible memorial C1 HEYBURN)
Column "D" (graves D1-D25; First visible memorial D2 GAULT)
Column "E" (graves E1-E30; First visible memorial E1 SPIERS)
Column "F" (graves F1-F29; First visible memorial F1 CARSON)
Column "G" (graves G1-G30; First visible memorial G2 STEVENS)
Column "H" (graves H1-H30; First visible memorial H1 PATTERSON)
Column "J" (graves J1-J28; First visible memorial J1 GETTY)

----
p.114

Your interest will be in row "B".
[The 2nd one in from the (far) Western side.]

The grave reference "J/B12" means SECTION "J" - Column "B" - Grave "12".


Now some "Maths":  12 (yours) / 28 (last) ~ 14/28 = 1/2.
So the grave is located ~1/2 way down (South) from the path at its top;
[N.B This is a guesstimate.
 Some graves are "longer" than others, especially large family graves.]

So:

1) continue walking West;

2) turn left (South) on the next path.
       [SECTION "H" is on your right (West); SECTION "J" is on your left (East).]

3) walk ~1/2 way down this path.
       [Running down the Western side of SECTION "J".]

4) for immediate geographical guidance look out for graves in the first (closest) column to your East:
       J/A10 (GRAHAM), J/A13 (SHAW), J/A14 (IRVINE/SCOTT/MULHOLLAND),
       J/A15 (ADAIR), J/A17 (LOWRY)
       [N.B. Couldn't find a reference to a J/A12.]

5) You need to be looking just beyond for a black marble stone & surround
        for J/B12 (CHRISTY) in the 2nd column (viz. "B").
     [J/B11 (BOYCE) lies adjacent North of it; J/B13 (McAVOY) immediately to the South.]

[N.B. There is a path running back along the full width of the bottom of graveyard.
 SECTIONs "J", "K" & "L" to lie to the left (North); SECTION "M" to the right (South).
 You can walk East along it, then turn left (North) at the far corner and walk straight to the top.

 If there has been heavy rain watch out for the mats of moss.
 They can "give way" en masse and you might fall down and hurt your pride!]
 
The surnames present on the memorials are listed alphabetically in the book.
[For SECTION "J" they cover pps. 106-116.
 There is one fallen/broken stone.]

==============

Hope that this gets you there.

I haven't included any of the inscription details.
[I've presumed that you'd prefer to "discover" them yourselves on another physical visit.]

All the best onward,

Captain Jock
E&OE
WHITTLEY - Donegore, Ballycraigy, Newtownards, Guernsey, PALI
WHITTLE - Dublin, Glenavy, Muckamore, Belfast; Jamaica; Norfolk (Virginia), Baltimore (Maryland), New York
CHAINE - Ballymena, Muckamore, Larne
EWART, DEWART - Portglenone, Ballyclare
McAFEE, WALKER - Ballyrashane

"You can't give kindness away enough, it keeps coming back to you."
Mark Twain (aka Samuel CLEMENTS) [Family origins from Ballynure, Co. Antrim.]

Offline fimcfi

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Re: Carnmoney Cemeteries
« Reply #8 on: Monday 30 August 21 08:20 BST (UK) »
Hi, I'm also looking for some help to locate gravesites for g.g.grandfather and g.g.grandmother; John McFee (or McPhee) and Elizabeth Montgomery who lived in Carnmoney and died before 1878. Their children; Arthur (b 1819), John (b 1821), Isabella (b1824) & my g.g.grandfather Robert (b 1828, died 1896 Paisley) were born in Carnmoney, the eldest 2 being baptised at Carnmoney Presbyterian Church. Any assistance would be gratefully received.
McPhee (McFee), Munro, Cunningham, McPherson, Porteous, Blair, Peacock, Purdon
Paisley, Inchinnan, Belfast