Author Topic: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland  (Read 6400 times)

Offline hallmark

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #9 on: Friday 05 October 18 00:37 BST (UK) »
1911 http://www.rootschat.com/links/01mtb/

I'd look but don't have any clue as to his age or if he was alive then or not
Give a man a record and you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to research, and you feed him for a lifetime.

Offline BallyaltikilliganG

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #10 on: Friday 05 October 18 09:45 BST (UK) »
tried https://www.ancestryireland.com
births
ALEXANDER   BELL   1876   father WILLIAM   Down
marriage
tried Ros Davies Co Down website  http://www.rosdavies.com
Miss   Elizabeth   DONALDSON   .   Drumgath   regd. Rathfriland; wife of Alexander Bell; mother of Samuel b. 1869

tried https://www.emeraldancestors.com
1857   Alexander  BELL   Eliza  Emmerald   Newry   Down
1857   Alexander  Emmerald   Eliza  DONALDSON   Newry   Down
worrying about newry district Drumgath civil parishis to the NE of Newrycivil parish sook by checking Ros Davies parish map of Co Down

all the above gives
William Bell
children 
Alexander Bell m 1857 Miss Elizabeth Donaldson Drumgath parish Regd. Rathfriland
children
Samuel Bell b 1869

I coulnt find further info on Samuel
try familysearch.org


looking for Barmeen try  http://www.rosdavies.com/PLACENAMES/BanBy.htm
checking two major records

learn to use https://www.failteromhat.com/post1845.php the result is
Bell   Martha   Church Street,Rathfryland   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Martha   Cross   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Alexander   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   John   Newry Street,Rathfryland   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Robert   Cross   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Robert   Drumgreenagh   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Sarah   Newry Street,Rathfryland   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Samuel   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Robert   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   John   John Street,Rathfryland   Drumgath   Down
Bell   John   Tullyquilly   Drumgath   Down
Bell   David   Ballykeel   Drumgath   Down
Bell   John   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Anne   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Andrew   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   David   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Daniel   Barnmeen   Drumgath   Down
Bell   David   Kiltarriff   Drumgath   Down
Bell   Jane   John Street,Rathfryland   Drumgath   Down
Bell   John   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down
Bell   James   Drumlough   Drumgath   Down

 sort  the above by townland learn how to look up any of the above people in http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/  spend time using every heading inc map references  then more time using the townland and hopefully finding the exact homesteadof the person showing fields and buildings not good when in large villages etc

back to church records use ros Davies church section for church records for Drumgath I noticed a very early Bell in drumgath
good luck lots of fun

Gracey Gracie Gracy Grassy Greacy
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Offline BallyaltikilliganG

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #11 on: Friday 05 October 18 10:05 BST (UK) »
a bit more
use census
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/

bell drumgath  eg 1901
Bell   David Glenny   Ballykeel   Drumgath   Down   58   M   County Down   Farmer   Presbyterian   Read and write      Head of Family   Married   
Bell   Margaret E   Ballykeel   Drumgath   Down   17   F   England   Farmer   Presbyterian   Read and write      Visitor   Not Married   
Bell   Sarah   Ballykeel   Drumgath   Down   44   F   County Down      Presbyterian   Read and write      Wife   Married   
Bell   Jeanny    Barnmeen   Drumgath   Down   56   F   Co Down   Farmer   Roman Catholic   Read and write      Head of Family   Not Married    
try the same for 1911

try lennonwylie for street directories  it will not be easy but rathfriland is listed under one of her headings  if you want earlier records that just name a person and a bit about land quality try
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/down/tithe-applotment-books/drumgath-parish.php#.W7cnPC-ZNEItry

ie
Bell, Daniel Townland: Barmeen Year: 1834
Bell, David Townland: Kiltarriff Year: 1834
Bell, Edward Townland: Cross Year: 1834
Bell, Edwd. Townland: Lessize Year: 1834
Bell, James Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Jno. Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Jno. Townland: Tullyquilly Year: 1834
Bell, John Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Joseph Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Robert Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Sampson Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Widow Townland: Drumgrenagh Year: 1834
Bell, William Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Willm. Townland: Drumlough Year: 1834
Bell, Willm. Townland: Kiltarriff Year: 1834

if you dont live in Co down try learning to get griffiths maps to switch to modern google satelitte views then clicking sometimes produces small street scene which means yo can go up and down the roads ancestors walked on spotting old buildings

goo luck
Gracey Gracie Gracy Grassy Greacy
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Offline Dalzell

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 06 October 18 00:09 BST (UK) »
Hi Ed:
RE: Alexander Bell m. Elizabeth Donaldson 30 April, 1857 (estimated birth dates 1834).  Their marriage was listed as Drumgath (Rathfriland) and the registration was listed as Rathfriland, Newry.  I went through the records for 2nd and 3rd Rathfriland Church to see if I could locate them for you, but unfortunately did not find them.  You may not find them on the 1901 Census as they would be in their late 60's and perhaps no longer alive.

RE: William Bell   I found a 2nd Church record in 1825 for William Bell & Mary Park having their 5th child, but no other records of the previous children so perhaps they moved from another Church.  No way to tell if this Wm. is connected.

RE: Joseph Bell   I found a 2nd Church record for Joseph Bell & xxx McKee baptising their first daughter in Jan. 1863, which would indicate they were married in 1862.  Family search does show Joseph Bell (son of Joseph) marrying Mary Ann McKee in Jan. 1862 in Drumgath.  No way to know if they are connected to your family.
Perhaps having these additional names will open some new sources.
It is a difficult process and the records are hard to find.  I wish you good luck.

I will keep search for you and perhaps something further will show up.

Dalzell.



Offline BallyaltikilliganG

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 06 October 18 09:24 BST (UK) »
hi Ed, ‘Dalzell’s contribution has narrowed your potential remaining sources for essential church records.  my question on the registered Rathfriland is that could be a civil ceremony, perhaps not a church marriage?
from the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland online Guide to Church records
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/sites/default/files/publications/Guide_to_church_records.pdf
DRUMGATH, CO. DOWN
C.I. Drumgath (Dromore diocese)
[Earliest registers destroyed in Dublin]
Vestry minutes and churchwardens’ account book, 1822-91.
Preachers’ book, 1818-60.
Baptisms, 1881-; marriages, 1846-; preachers’ books, 1893-.
P. 1st Rathfriland and P. 2nd Rathfriland  see Dalzell above.
P. 3rd Rathfriland
Baptisms, 1834-1934; marriages, 1834-1935; communion roll, 1865-79.
Minute book of Sunday School, 1833-82, and roll book, 1853-80, with gaps.
R.C. Drumgath (Dromore diocese)
Baptisms, 1829-81; marriages and burials, 1837-80.
R.P. Rathfriland
Baptisms, 1857-1916; marriages, 1864-1943; deaths, 1857-68 and 1925-84; admissions, 1857-1972; lists of members with details of emigrations, deaths and marriages, 1884-1944; lists of members removed, 1924-45; session minutes, 1857-1908; history of the church, published in 1977.

Dalzells contribution has narrowed your potential remaining sources for church records, my take on the registered Rathfriland is that it was a civil ceremony

the 1901 census
40 in Barnmeen (Drumgath, Down)
Bell Jeanny 56 Female Head of Family Roman Catholic Co Down Farmer Read and write - Not Married -
Keenan Bridget 12 Female Visitor Roman Catholic Co Down Scholar Read and write - Not Married
Crey Sam 29 Male Boarder Presbyterian Co Down Agricultural Labourer Read and write - Not Married
18 in Ballykeel (Drumgath, Down)
Bell David Glenny 58 Male Head of Family Presbyterian County Down Farmer Read and write - Married -
McLaughlin William J 17 Male Servant Epescoplian Co Armagh Servant Read and write - Not Married
Bell Margaret E 17 Female Visitor Presbyterian England Farmer Read and write - Not Married -
Bell Sarah 44 Female Wife Presbyterian County Down - Read and write - Married -

the 1911 census
49 in Barnmeen (Drumgath, Down)
Bell Fanny 66 Female Head of Family Roman Catholic Co Down Farmer Read and write - Single - - - -
Crey Samuel 42 Male Servant Presbyterian Co Down Farm Servant Read and write -
Keenan Bridget 21 Female Lodger Roman Catholic Co Down Scholar Read and write Irish and English Single -
22 in Tullyquilly (Drumgath, Down)
Bell James 64 Male Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Down Agricultural Labourer Cannot Read - Married - - -Bell Elizabeth 42 Female Wife Church of Ireland Co Down - Cannot Read - Married - 21 [m 1891]  6 born 1 living
106 in Newry Street (Rathfryland, Down)
Bell David Glenny 71 Male Head of Family Presbyterian Ireland, Co Down Retired Farmer Read and write - Married - 25 [m ~1887] -Bell Sarah 56 Female Wife Presbyterian Ireland, Co Down - Read and write - Married - 25 - -

1864 Griffiths Valuation http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/ Barmeen townland
has a Daniel Bell at No 50 10 acres, house valued £1pa checking property

checking in Griffiths Valuation continuation sheets in PRONI
VAL/12/B/22/10B (1866 - 1882) shows a  Bell first name crossed out twice Daniel is one of the names
VAL/12/B/22/10B (1883 - 1893) ) shows a Jane Bell 10 acres, house valued £1pa
VAL/12/B/22/10C (1894 - 1908) shows a Jane Bell with alterations in mo 50
VAL/12/B/22/10D (1909 - 1929) shows a Jane Bell in No 50 is taken over in 1916 by a James Keenan
 note  Fanny/ jeanny bell had a bridget keenan living with herin 1901, 1911
good luck onwards
Gracey Gracie Gracy Grassy Greacy
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Offline Dalzell

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 06 October 18 22:31 BST (UK) »
Hi Ed:
William and Alexander Bell of Drumlough.
I have documented from 1769 Freeholder Records through to 1929 PRONI Valuation Records.  There were other Bell families in the same area but I just focused on the land #7 James/William Bell to Isaac and Susan Irvine; and #37 Alexander & Samuel Bell to John A Bell to William Bell.

Maybe something will help you track your family.

Bells of Drumlough
Records in chronological order for the earliest to the latest Bell families in Drumlough.
1769   Freeholder List: (first record in Drumlough)
#363  Alexander Bell
#368  John Bell (rejected)
#369  James Bell
#370  William Bell
1789   Freeholder List: (second registration & addition of their sons)
#824  William Bell
#825  Alexander Bell
#826  Samuel
#827  James
PRONI Freeholder records
Lease of Lives in a Deed indicates usually three lives of children /grandchildren of the person taking the lease.  The lease expired when all three named had died.
1813 Joseph Bell      - Lives of James, Joseph & James Bell)
   James Bell        -(Lives of James Bell)
1815   William Bell    - (Lives of Alex Bell, Joseph Morrow & Margaret Bell)
   James Bell            - (Lives of John & Samuel Bell & John Donaldson)
   John Bell            - (Lives of James & Isabella Bell & John Woods)
1823   James Bell            - (Lives of John & Samuel Bell & John Donaldson)
   William Bell    - (Lives of Alexander Bell, Joseph Morrow & Margaret Bell)
   John Bell            - (Lives of John & Samuel Bell & John Donaldson)
   John Bell            - (Lives of James & Isabella Bell & John Woods)
1864   The records then jump to 1864 with the Griffith’s Valuation Records:
#7   Drumlough      - James Bell     19A 2R 35P
#37 Drumlough      - Alexander Bell     3A 1 R 25P
                                  John Bell, Grocer    1P 20R

#7   Valuation Records of James Bell     19A 2R 35P
1866   Changes from James Bell to William Bell
1893   Changes from William Bell (d. 23 May 1892) to Isaac Irvine
1895   Changes from Isaac Irvine to Wm. & Joseph Bell
1913   Split into two sections A & B
     7A Isaac Irvine changes to Susan Irvine
     7B Joseph Bell/William Bell changes to James McCartney 1916 then to John Graham 1920
1924     7A Susan Irvine changes to Elizabeth A. Annett
     7B John Graham
1923/  7A Elizabeth Annett
1929     7B John Graham
Note: 1911 Census Isaac and Susan Irvine’s name is spelled Irwin.  They are registered in Drumlough with their daughters Martha and Elizabeth (Lizzie).

#37   Valuation Records for Alexander Bell   3A 1R 25P
1866   a)  Alexander Bell
   b)  John Bell (Grocer)   House and garden – changed in 1878 to Alexander & Samuel Bell
        Changed in 1886 to John A. Bell
1895   a)  Alex Bell to Elizabeth Bell
   b)  Alex Bell & John A. Bell to Reps. 1896 (d. 9 Sep. 1895)
1907      John A. Bell to William Bell
1920-23 William Bell
1923-29 William  Bell


Dalzell

Offline Ed Belbin

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 15 October 20 02:57 BST (UK) »
Looking over this information and I don't think I properly thanked you for all your efforts on my behalf.  I put this research down for some time and I'm just picking it back up.

Sincerely,
Ed

Offline Kiltaglassan

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Re: Bell Family of Drumgath, Rathfriland
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 15 October 20 12:49 BST (UK) »

Welcome to RootsChat  :)

Hamlets was last active on RootsChat in August this year. If his/her email is still current then he/she will get a notification of your post. When you make one more post, you can use the PM (Personal Message) system to communicate with him/her.

KG

Researching: Cuthbertson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Australia; Hunter – Co. Derry; Jackson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Canada; Scott – Co. Derry; Neilly – Co. Antrim & USA; McCurdy – Co. Antrim; Nixon – Co. Cavan, Co. Donegal, Canada & USA; Ryan & Noble – Co. Sligo