Hello to those researching Bernard Traynor and Mary Hoey / Hoy and specificially their son Edward Traynor and Sarah Ellen Kay and their son John Henry Traynor who emigrated to America.
I am distantly related to Sarah Ellen Kay who married Edward Traynor. Their 1st born son Bernard Thomas Astley Traynor was named after his paternal grandfather and as Thomas Astley Jordan the step-father of Sarah.
As of 1851 at least, there was a RC church named Cathedral Church of St John the Evangelist in Salford, otherwise commonly known as Salford Cathedral and in it, the last 2 children of Bernard and Mary were baptised with 1 record giving Mary's maiden name as "Hoey" and the other as "Hoy" so because John gave her maiden name as Hoey as well, I would lean toward that one myself.
Baptism: 8 Jun 1851 Cathedral Church of St John the Evangelist, Salford, Lancashire, England
Thomas W. Trainor - [Child] of Bernard Trainor & Mary (formerly Hoey)
Born: 13 Apr 1851
Godparents: Edwd. Trainor; Jane Roche
Baptised by: Denis Byrne
Register: Baptisms 1843 - 1855, Page 94
Source: Original Register at LRO
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Baptism: 24 Apr 1853 Cathedral Church of St John the Evangelist, Salford, Lancashire, England
Ellen Jane Traynor - [Child] of Bernard Traynor & Mary (formerly Hoy)
Born: 9 Apr 1853
Godparents: Edward Traynor; Bridget McCormick
Baptised by: James Wilding
Register: Baptisms 1843 - 1855, Page 136
Source: Original Register at LRO
John Henry Traynor and Elizabeth (Hope) McCaslin cause even more mystery than what you thought when you found their 1907 marriage!
Although they didn't marry until 1907, she is listed as Elizabeth Trainor in 1900 Census and both of them state that they have been married for 25 years.
I began looking again and found their 1st marriage so many years before + believe me, that was a huge surprise!
Name John H. Traynor
Event Type Marriage
Event Date 21 Oct 1874
Event Place Fall River, Bristol, Massachusetts, United States
Age 28
Birth Year (Estimated) 1846
Father's Name Bernard
Mother's Name Mary
Spouse's Name Elizabeth Hope Mccoslin
Spouse's Age 30
Spouse's Birth Year (Estimated) 1844
Spouse's Father's Name Daniel [her stepfather, Daniel Hannagan / Hannigan]
Spouse's Mother's Name Martha [nee Taylor]
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Name John H Traynor, FIRST MARRIAGE
Event Type Marriage
Event Date 15 Jun 1907
Event Place Fall River, Bristol, Massachusetts, United States
Age 58
Birth Date 1849
Birthplace , , England
Father's Name Bernard Traynor
Mother's Name Mary Hoey
Spouse's Name Elizabeth Hope Mccaslin, SECOND MARRIAGE / Widowed
Spouse's Age 68
Spouse's Birth Date 1839
Spouse's Birthplace , , England
Spouse's Father's Name Richard [NOT correct]
Spouse's Mother's Name Martha Entwistle [thought maybe she remarried after Daniel but cannot find anything]
Elizabeth's parents were Charles Hope and Martha Taylor which I found on her sister Mary's death record in Fall River, Bristol, Massachusetts =
Massachusetts Deaths
Name Mary Hope Grimshaw
Event Type Death
Event Date 30 Jul 1902
Event Place Fall River, Massachusetts
Residence Place Fall River, Massachusetts
Address 239 Middle
Gender Female
Age 66
Marital Status Married
Occupation Housekeeper
Birthplace England
Birth Year (Estimated) 1836
Burial Place Fall River
Father's Name Charles
Father's Birthplace England
Mother's Name Martha Taylor
Mother's Birthplace England
Spouse's Name William Grimshaw
Although I was able to find Mary's baptism, I couldn't find anything for Elizabeth =
Baptism: 22 Nov 1835 Cathedral, Manchester, Lancashire, England
Mary Hope - Daughter of Charles Hope & Martha
Abode: Manch.
Occupation: Labourer
Baptised by: H. Fielding
Register: Baptisms 1835 - 1836, Page 668, Entry 5341
Source: LDS Film 2357018
Here's Mary Hope's marriage record showing that this was her 3rd marriage =
Name William Grimshaw
Event Type Marriage
Event Date 8 Oct 1889
Event Place Fall River, Bristol, Massachusetts, United States
Age 33
Marital Status HIS SECOND MARRIAGE
Birth Year (Estimated) 1856
Birthplace Norton, Bristol, Massachusetts, United States
Father's Name Thomas
Mother's Name Jane
Spouse's Name Mary Hope Connelly
Spouse's Age 53
Spouse's Marital Status HER THIRD MARRIAGE
Spouse's Birth Year (Estimated) 1836
Spouse's Birthplace England, United Kingdom
Spouse's Father's Name Charles
Spouse's Mother's Name Martha
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I have found the marriage of Elizabeth Hope to Joseph McCaslin April 15, 1860 in Cathedral, Manchester and found them in the 1861 Census in Hulme, Lancashire with their son Joseph McCaslin born 1861 but cannot locate young John after that.
Joseph McCaslin and Emma Hardacre were married 1876 and had 11 children although their eldest Joseph was born abt 1874, a couple of years before their marriage.
Emma died Oct 26, 1915 and Joseph was deceased by 1911 at the latest.
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MORE DETAILS on Mary Hope and her 2 husbands before her marriage in Fall River.
It turns out that Mary Hope 1st married William Tootall in 1856 and had 2 children: Amelia and Robert.
She then married Bernard Conlan [not Connelly] in 1869 and one of the witnesses was her sister Elizabeth McCaslin.
Turns out that Martha and Daniel Flannigan [not Hannagan / Hannigan after all] emigrated to Fall River, MA as well and died there.
