Good grief, that was quick !
Thanks all for the input folks
Just to answer a few questions in order that the replies came...
'Ciderdrinker': Yes i have seen the Alles Orrit connection, i established a while ago that Valentine was married first to Alles, then Catherine Green later on. All in all Valentine had 14 kids between the two marriages, and i have detailed research on all of them and their descendents
miriamkinga : The Valentine Walls you mention b 1728 was the son of the Valentine Walls i am looking at...All in all there are at least 7 Valentine Walls in the tree that i know of, and around 3 in Robert's line. In fact there three Valentine Walls males lived at the same time in the same small street in Leigh near Wigan at one time, and the street came to be known as Valentine Walls houses !
heatherjulie : Well pointed out, yes this is the Valentine Walls 1700-1774 and he was indeed buried at St.Katherines in Blackrod, although i still have no idea where he was born
heatherjulie : Valenidinus Waltz is a name i am looking at currently, as i am investigating the possibility that Valentine Walls immigrated into England as one of the 'poor palatines' in 1709 to escape the strife going on due to war of succession, etc, although the list of palatine immigrants (refugees) doesn't contain his name, or any combination of Walls/Whalls/Waltz, but research is ongoing as there were other influxes prior to the main one in 1709
Radcliff : I would love William s of William Walls of Bolton to be a part of this, as this would extend my research, but i just can't prove it, and have looked at this name many times on LAN OPC
Radcliff :Henrie i have also looked at, and his name proves that the Walls clan was in Blackrod way before 1700, but again i cannot prove that Henrie or William his father are part of the line, although it is highly likely they both are with the Blackrod/St.Katherine connection
The Alles Walls is proven to be Valentines Wife's burial in 1749, and yes she is the first wife of Valentine. As for your next point about Dolley, she was a character, and had 3 or 4 kids out of wedlock, she is in the tree already and is part of the descendant line.
Your point about being sure that Valentine and Robert being Blackrod born and bred is the big question, i have no proof that either brother was born in Blackrod, the first time they appear on the record is Robert's first childs baptism Agnis Walls 1727-1754, and they lived in Millgate, with Roberts wife Elizabeth (surname unknown, marriage date unknown). Valentine appears on his marriage day to Alles Orritt married in Bolton-Le-Moors, so Robert appears in 1727, and Valentine in 1724, no baptism for either in the entire country prior to these dates, we just have estimates
In Blackrod there were other Walls such as Abigail, and Jane, but again no proven connection to either line.
andrewalston : You are my hero, We have spoken many times via email, and your gedcom file on roots web has been of massive help, although the team have been quietly digging since last we spoke, and we have uncovered another line of Walls in Blackrod at the same time, the earliest member was John Walls born in 1755, who's descendants formed the Walls in the Hindley,Ince, and Weshoughton strands including Parnell Walls (Nee Isherwood). I think Valentine, Robert, and John have a common ancestor. On a different note, Robert lived in Wigan (Millgate, and his occupation was 'taylor), so maybe i'll join you for a sausage and ice cream lunch quite soon !
The reason i know that they were brothers is because they appeared as witnesses at each others kids baptisms and marriages, and Robert lived in Blackrod for a brief time. In fact the Walls clan were professional witnesses, and appeared at multiple unrelated marriages, baptisms and the like.
Radcliff : I spotted the Irish connection very recently, and have the baptism record. This is my current line of research, as the poor palatines entered the UK into Chester the main port at that time, then were transferred into Chester by wagons. Some stayed, most went on to Ireland, where some disembarked, and the majority went to America....
I am currently in contact with the Walls DNA project, who have proven a DNA link match between Ireland Walls,:
Subgroup: Group VII
Name: Not Disclosed
Most Distant Ancestor: Walter DeVal Wall, b1505 d1570
Marker Location: Eyrecourt county, Galway, Ireland
Lat, Lng: (52.3988953, -8.573311)
And English Walls:
Subgroup: Group VII
Name: Not Disclosed
Most Distant Ancestor: Mark Wall, 1690, 1740.
Marker Location: Stanhope, Bishop Auckland, County Durham, UK
Lat, Lng: (54.7473831, -2.0067153)
The De Vall name also seems like a connection with Wall.
So loads of possible angles, and speculation, but the question remains, where did Valentine Walls and his brother Robert come from ?
Thanks for all the input folks, its greatly appreciated
