Author Topic: **COMPLETED** A Mary Smith Problem !  (Read 2970 times)

Offline SmallTownGirl

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**COMPLETED** A Mary Smith Problem !
« on: Thursday 25 April 13 21:00 BST (UK) »
I now have the marriage certificate for

Harry Clements, 23, miner, Newthorpe, s/o William Thomas Clements, miner
and
Mary Alice Smith, 24, - , Newthorpe, d/o Harry Smith, lace maker

which took place at the parish church in Greasley on 23 Aug 1913.

So set about looking for a Harry Smith and daughter Mary in/around Greasley on the 1911 census.  Nothing.  I did manage to find a Henry (b. abt 1844 Gotham, Notts) and wife Jane, with a daughter Alice in 1911 in Heanor, and the same in 1891 where daughter is Mary Alice, so I wondered if this could be "my" Mary Alice.

There are 3 possible Mary Alice Smiths b. in the right window of time:

1. Q3, 1889, Basford
2. Q1, 1890, Basford
3. Q2, 1890, Chesterfield

Putting the Chesterfield one aside for now, I wondered if anyone could find a baptism for one of them in Heanor, possibly St Lawrence (where they are in the 1891 census), and then I need to see if someone could find another Mary Alice a bit nearer to Newthorpe/Greasley/Eastwood/Giltbrook etc.

Can anyone help, please?

Thanks
STG

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Offline rosie99

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 27 April 13 07:35 BST (UK) »
Hi

Who were the witnesses to the marriage

Rosie
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline SmallTownGirl

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 27 April 13 09:24 BST (UK) »
Witnesses were, groom's father (William Thomas Clements), two of groom's sisters (Nellie [Ellen] and Alice) and a William Henry Stanley (no idea who he is).

So, three from Harry Clements' side of the family and a mystery man.

Doesn't help much, does it?

STG
Always looking for GOODWINS in Berkshire :)


Offline rosie99

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 27 April 13 13:42 BST (UK) »
Witnesses were, groom's father (William Thomas Clements), two of groom's sisters (Nellie [Ellen] and Alice) and a William Henry Stanley (no idea who he is).

So, three from Harry Clements' side of the family and a mystery man.

Doesn't help much, does it?

STG

 :'(    You are right, unless Wm Hy Stanley is a clue not much help.

I do wonder about her fathers name 'Harry' particularly as it is the same as her husbands.  :-\  There are a few Henry/Harry's occ Lace Maker but none with dtr Mary.

There is a Mary Alice Smith listed as 'Niece' to William Roberts bn 1842 Granby & his wife Caroline in 1901 and later.  They are in Papplewick in 1901 which is close to Greasley RG13/3159
F63 p19 but tracking back her father isn't Harry.  :-\

Rosie
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline SmallTownGirl

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 27 April 13 15:53 BST (UK) »
My thought was that if the baptisms of the two Basford-registered Mary Alice Smiths could be found, hopefully one (and not both - nightmare!) would have a Harry/Henry as a father and also provide the mother's given name. 

Looks like I'll have to take myself off to Matlock to see if I can find anything in/around Heanor (this side of the Derbys/Notts border), before a trip to Nottingham for Greasley/Eastwood/Giltbrook etc (for the other side of the Derby/Notts border).

Thanks
STG

I've just found William Henry Stanley!  He married Harry Clements' sister, Ellen (Nellie) in 1914.  So, at least we know who he is, and that he's neither use nor ornament to help with Mary Alice's father.
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Offline SmallTownGirl

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 27 April 13 17:08 BST (UK) »
And now I find that St Lawrence, Heanor baptisms are available on line.

No Mary Alice Smith.

I know they say that when one door closes another one opens, but it's not happening for me yet!  :(

Always looking for GOODWINS in Berkshire :)

Offline rosie99

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 27 April 13 17:12 BST (UK) »

I've just found William Henry Stanley!  He married Harry Clements' sister, Ellen (Nellie) in 1914.  So, at least we know who he is, and that he's neither use nor ornament to help with Mary Alice's father.

It is good that you have found him but a shame he married Nellie Clements and not a relation of Mary.   ;)  I do wonder about Mary as none of her family are evident on her marriage though.

Rosie

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline SmallTownGirl

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 27 April 13 17:26 BST (UK) »
Yes, I wonder about her too. 

The Clements side sure packed out the witnessing, didn't they?

Maybe Mary Alice will have to remain a woman of mystery. Drat! :(
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Offline SmallTownGirl

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Re: A Mary Smith Problem !
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 02 May 13 09:43 BST (UK) »
Just to let you know, I was able to nab a few minutes at Notts Archive yesterday and checked the original marriage cert for Harry Clements and Mary Alice Smith.  As I thought, her father's name had been mis-transcribed.  On the copy he's Harry, on the original, he's clearly Henry.

That leads me to the Mary Alice who was brought up in Heanor by Henry and Jane, rather than the one b.Kimberley who was brought up by her aunt Caroline.  Also my friend rang an elderly relative who said that Mary had a sister Edith and brother Albert, and that also ties in with the Heanor family.

I found a marriage for Henry to Jane in 1870 in Gotham (Notts), but didn't manage in the v.short time I had to find a baptism for Henry or a marriage for his father.  If FS don't have the info I might have to go back, but that wouldn't be a problem.

Thanks for your help and input.
STG

PS : Will mark this completed in a few days
Always looking for GOODWINS in Berkshire :)