Author Topic: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan  (Read 891 times)

Offline Malcolm33

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Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« on: Wednesday 05 June 13 21:54 BST (UK) »
      I found Rosetta and her daughter Annie in Family Search Census for 1891 and am now trying to discover who they were living with in Newcastle.     Rosetta describes herself as 'Sister-in-law' and Annie as a Niece.    Rosetta married my gt.grandfather James Draffan the following year and her maiden name was Hoskins.

     Could somebody please help?
Hutton: Eccleshill,Queensbury
Grant: Babworth,Chinley
Draffan: Lesmahagow,Douglas,Coylton, Consett
Oliver: Tanfield, Sunderland, Consett
Proudlock: Northumberland
Turnbull:Northumberland, Durham
Robson:Sunderland, Northumberland
Dent: Dufton, Arkengarthdale, Hunstanworth
Currie: Coylton
Morris and Hurst: East Retford, Blyth, Worksop
Elliot: Castleton, Hunstanworth, Consett
Tassie, Greenshields

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Online keyboard86

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 05 June 13 22:00 BST (UK) »
Hi they are shown as Sister in Law and Niece to a Stephen E Doughty 52 occ Electrical Engineer b London, Middx and wife Annie 40 b Ilfracombe, Devon
Residing at 100, Cromwell Street, Newcastle upon Tyne
Census Ref RG12/4197/132/7
Keyboard86
Pelly/Pelley/Kingsbury/Challis/Nalder/Rochester/Raydenbow

UK Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

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Offline Malcolm33

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 05 June 13 23:32 BST (UK) »
Hi they are shown as Sister in Law and Niece to a Stephen E Doughty 52 occ Electrical Engineer b London, Middx and wife Annie 40 b Ilfracombe, Devon
Residing at 100, Cromwell Street, Newcastle upon Tyne
Census Ref RG12/4197/132/7
Keyboard86

   Now this comes as a big surprise.    Many thanks Keyboard.       Annie can't be any sister we know of, of Rosetta's and Doughty is as much unknown.    So looks like Annie age 40 must have been a sister of the very elusive Edward Allan/Allen.    Thanks again.
Hutton: Eccleshill,Queensbury
Grant: Babworth,Chinley
Draffan: Lesmahagow,Douglas,Coylton, Consett
Oliver: Tanfield, Sunderland, Consett
Proudlock: Northumberland
Turnbull:Northumberland, Durham
Robson:Sunderland, Northumberland
Dent: Dufton, Arkengarthdale, Hunstanworth
Currie: Coylton
Morris and Hurst: East Retford, Blyth, Worksop
Elliot: Castleton, Hunstanworth, Consett
Tassie, Greenshields

Online keyboard86

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 06 June 13 00:45 BST (UK) »
 :) I thought something was odd, as this appears to be the marriage:-

Stephen Ebenezer Doughty to (on same page) Annie Miall March qtr 1891 Newcastle upon Tyne 10b 168

Keyboard86
Pelly/Pelley/Kingsbury/Challis/Nalder/Rochester/Raydenbow

UK Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Malcolm33

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 06 June 13 01:04 BST (UK) »
:) I thought something was odd, as this appears to be the marriage:-

Stephen Ebenezer Doughty to (on same page) Annie Miall March qtr Newcastle upon Tyne 10b 168

Keyboard86
   Yes I just found that and Annie Miall is a big mystery.   No trace of a birth in that name, so I assume that he was married to a Miall.   Stephen Doughty was born in 1838 in Holborn/Islington and married Eliza Draper in 1866.   Eliza died in Newcastle in Sep qtr of 1890.   That more or less rules out Stephen as being a relative of Rosetta or any of the Hoskins, unless he was an unknown half brother.
    Cannot find any marriage of a Miall or Myall to an Annie, so I am now checking all the Annie's born around 1850/2 in the Barnstaple district which covered Ilfracombe.
Hutton: Eccleshill,Queensbury
Grant: Babworth,Chinley
Draffan: Lesmahagow,Douglas,Coylton, Consett
Oliver: Tanfield, Sunderland, Consett
Proudlock: Northumberland
Turnbull:Northumberland, Durham
Robson:Sunderland, Northumberland
Dent: Dufton, Arkengarthdale, Hunstanworth
Currie: Coylton
Morris and Hurst: East Retford, Blyth, Worksop
Elliot: Castleton, Hunstanworth, Consett
Tassie, Greenshields

Offline Malcolm33

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 11 July 19 06:23 BST (UK) »
This has all turned into one of those big mysteries where the main character turns out to be a philanderer, never marrying, but getting a few lasses pregnant all over the country.   Grenville Miall was born in 1848 in Eling Hants and is easy to find in 1851 and 1861 census', but then disappears off the grid except when named as the father of a child.

In 1874 a Julia Jane Miall was born in Manchester to mother Mary Jane Miall nee Dakin and father Grenville Miall who at that time said he was a soldier abode Dundalk (near Dublin).     In the last quarter of 1875 a brother, Horatio Grenville Miall was born in Kensington, London, mother's maiden name 'Deakin'.    In the very same last quarter of 1875 Mary Jane Miall died in Kensington, London.   

Then in 1881 the 7 year old girl now called Julia Anne Miall and her 5 year old brother Horatio Grenville Miall are with grandparents or grand uncle, in Manchester.   In 1891 Horatio was in a Boy's home in Salford, Manchester.    He went on to get married and have his own family though in 1911 the census reads birthplace London or Manchester - not certain which!

In 1886 Anne Miall was born in Wednesbury Staffs to Rosetta Maria Miall formerly Hoskins and Grenville Miall who is now a Clock Maker in Church Street.

In 1887 a Grenville Ashworth Miall was born in Birkenhead, mother's maiden name 'Conibear',  but this poor lad died just 3 years later in the first quarter of 1891 in Newcastle Upon Tyne (I have ordered the death certificate in the hope that the address in Newcastle will identify his mother - should have it by the 17th July).   

In the same quarter of 1891 Annie Miall (could she be the Conibear mother?) married Stephen Ebeneezer Doughty.   Rosetta and her daughter Anne, now calling themselves 'Allen' are in the same household as Stephen and his new wife Annie.

Rosetta then married my great grandfather James Currie Draffan in 1892 when both were living at 34 Durham Street, Newcastle.   By 1911 James and Rosetta had moved to Stockton, but Stephen and Annie were at their old address of 34 Durham Street, having moved there from Cromwell St.

   As for Grenville, well he cannot be found anywhere after 1886, though was very likely in Birkenhead in 1874 or 1875.    His Miall cousins did live in Birkenhead at that time.
Hutton: Eccleshill,Queensbury
Grant: Babworth,Chinley
Draffan: Lesmahagow,Douglas,Coylton, Consett
Oliver: Tanfield, Sunderland, Consett
Proudlock: Northumberland
Turnbull:Northumberland, Durham
Robson:Sunderland, Northumberland
Dent: Dufton, Arkengarthdale, Hunstanworth
Currie: Coylton
Morris and Hurst: East Retford, Blyth, Worksop
Elliot: Castleton, Hunstanworth, Consett
Tassie, Greenshields

Offline River Tyne Lass

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 11 July 19 17:40 BST (UK) »
I found this at the Newcastle City library on way home from work in the Elswick burial register:

Entry 14393
Grenville A. Miall
Male
3 years
100 Cromwell Street
Date of burial March 22 1891
Section K   Grave No 249
Removed from St Paul's Parish

http://www.margaret-hall-genealogy.com/USERIMAGES/Elswick%20&%20St%20John%20Cemetery%20-%20Newcastle%20upon%20Tyne(4).jpg

This shows a map of cemetery.  He was buried in consecrated ground.  Click on the map for Elswick to enlarge.

Entry 13974
Eliza Doughty
Female
54 years
1  Ridley Court, Groat Market
Date of burial July 30 1890
Section K  Grave 244
Removed from St John's Parish

Conroy, Fitzpatrick, Watson, Miller, Davis/Davies, Brown, Senior, Dodds, Grieveson, Gamesby, Simpson, Rose, Gilboy, Malloy, Dalton, Young, Saint, Anderson, Allen, McKetterick, McCabe, Drummond, Parkinson, Armstrong, McCarroll, Innes, Marshall, Atkinson, Glendinning, Fenwick, Bonner

Offline Malcolm33

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 11 July 19 20:34 BST (UK) »
 Oh Gee, Thank You so much River Tyne Lass.    I don't think I'll get much more, if anything more from  the Death Certificate.     100 Cromwell Street was indeed the address that Stephen Doughty and his new wife Annie Miall nee Conibear, Rosetta Allen and her daughter also Annie Miall were living at in the 1891 census.
 I have just received a copy of the marriage certificate for Stephen Doughty and Annie Miall, from Pat in England which has confirmed that Annie Miall's father was John Conibear as I had suspected.  However they were at Bentinck Street and Carlisle Street when they married on the 20th January, 1891.   Stephen was getting about.   In 1881 he was in Falconer Street.
  Well then next step is for us to get the 1887 birth certificate for Grenville Ashworth Miall, poor wee soul as that should name a father - probably Grenville - and an address in Birkenhead where other Miall's were born around the same time but different father, I think.   All of these Miall's came from Portsea Hants.
   Pat and her husband are going on a Cruise to Norway tomorrow, so I'm so glad that she will have all this news before she leaves.
   It was a bit of a wild deduction finding Annie Miall to have been a Conibear, and this proves the value of checking births and deaths in GRO records rather than FreeBMD since they give you the mother's maiden name in the earliest records.
   That lad Grenville didn't live a short life in vain.  Were it not for him we could never have traced the Birkenhead connection.
    I feel sure that Pat will honour him with a visit to his last resting place when she can visit the north east.   She lives down south, but perhaps her cruise could be from 'Toon'?
     Now here's a treat for you when you next visit Newcastle City Library, just take a look at the Evening Chronicle for the 10th August, 1939 and go to page 5.   Look at the Castleside Wedding photo top left - the young 6 year old Page Boy, well that's me.    I know, not only because it names cousin Leslie Bonell but because I have another photo of just the wedding party with a clearer picture of myself.
       Thanks Again, Pet, 'n Ga Canny,  Malcolm
Hutton: Eccleshill,Queensbury
Grant: Babworth,Chinley
Draffan: Lesmahagow,Douglas,Coylton, Consett
Oliver: Tanfield, Sunderland, Consett
Proudlock: Northumberland
Turnbull:Northumberland, Durham
Robson:Sunderland, Northumberland
Dent: Dufton, Arkengarthdale, Hunstanworth
Currie: Coylton
Morris and Hurst: East Retford, Blyth, Worksop
Elliot: Castleton, Hunstanworth, Consett
Tassie, Greenshields

Offline River Tyne Lass

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Re: Look Up please for 1891 Rosetta and Annie Allan
« Reply #8 on: Friday 12 July 19 22:58 BST (UK) »
Hi Malcolm,

You are welcome.  I am happy to have been able to help out with this.  The next time I do a look up I will look out for your page boy photo.

Gan canny yersel hinny. :)

Conroy, Fitzpatrick, Watson, Miller, Davis/Davies, Brown, Senior, Dodds, Grieveson, Gamesby, Simpson, Rose, Gilboy, Malloy, Dalton, Young, Saint, Anderson, Allen, McKetterick, McCabe, Drummond, Parkinson, Armstrong, McCarroll, Innes, Marshall, Atkinson, Glendinning, Fenwick, Bonner