Author Topic: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa  (Read 7433 times)

Offline Roborhodie

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Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« on: Monday 28 October 13 01:50 GMT (UK) »
Can anybody help me? I am looking for any information regarding my great grandparents. I would like to travel to Cyprus and of 2014 and look up anything that I can. However, I am pulling my hair out through lack of information.

My great grandparents, Gabriel and Lotifia "Lottie" Robas (nee Georgora) lived in Cyprus and then travelled to Australia in the mid to late 1800 by ship. There is a possibility that they went to Australia at the time of the gold rush in about 1854 - 57 though this is an assumption based on information from the internet. I believe that they may have had a child (or children) in Australia before leaving by ship to go to South Africa.

My grandfather, (birth certificate): Fred Robas (death certificate): Frederick Charles Robas, was born on the ship which was just outside Durban on 22nd November 1901. He died on 14th July 1939 in Bulawayo, Southern Rhodesia

Though I have given a bit of information about my grandfather, I am interested in my great grandparents and their lives in Cyprus and Australia, which ships they would have used for their migrations. Help would be appreciated.

Trevor Robas
 

Offline giblet

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #1 on: Monday 28 October 13 04:16 GMT (UK) »

There is a possibility that they went to Australia at the time of the gold rush in about 1854 - 57 though this is an assumption based on information from the internet

If the above is right then Lotifia would have been way to old to have a child in 1901.



Offline giblet

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #2 on: Monday 28 October 13 04:51 GMT (UK) »
If possible can you post all the details from your grandfather's birth and death certificates please. It might help us to find something for you  :)

Offline jorose

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #3 on: Monday 28 October 13 17:14 GMT (UK) »
Let's start here (Zimbabwe Death registers):
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-14684-32108-16?cc=1837900&wc=7118311
F.C. Robas, D.R. 55/107  - turns out equivalent to 1939, no additional info.
Lottie George Robas, DR. 79/5 10515
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-14685-23271-40?cc=1837900&wc=7118398
She died 27th June 1948 aged 72.  Parents are only listed as unk. surname "George", marriage in Cyprus date unknown, says that Gabriel died in 1936 and lists three living children - two sons and a daughter

So she was b. about 1876 and probably the earliest possible date for emigration to Australia is mid-1890s.

There's also "death notices" for Zimbabwe on familysearch but they appear to be unindexed - will have a look a bit later.
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Offline Fide et Fortitudine

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 30 January 14 11:43 GMT (UK) »
Hi Trevor, welcome to Rootschat.   :)

In order to try and trace your ancestors' births or marriages in Cyprus, you would have to know their religion in order to track down their parish church.  The religion can often be inferred from names.  Greek-Cypriot Christian names point to the Greek Orthodox faith 90% of the time, but conversions were possible, as were inter-faith marriages. 

Now, Lotifia is definitely not a Greek or Cypriot name.  One way to check this is to see if there are any Eastern Orthodox saints with the same name - the Greek Orthodox Church forbids baptisms with non-Orthodox names.  There are no St. Lotifias.  So could it be a variant of Latifia/Latifah (Arabic) or Latife (Turkish)?  There was a large Muslim population all over Cyprus in the 19th century, then under Ottoman rule.  Nowadays the North is mostly Turkish Muslim.  Or, could it be a variation of Lot (Hebrew)?  There were many Sephardic Jews on the island in the past, especially around Famagusta in the late Ottoman period.  Many would have become Hellenicised over generations, intermarried with Greek Orthodox and converted to Christianity.   

Her maiden surname Georgora (variant: Georgoura) can be found in Greece today, but it is quite unusual in Cyprus. It means "of George".  The male surname is Georgoras, with an 's' at the end.  One problem with identifying ancestors in Cyprus and Greece is that Greek surnames used to be dynamic (changeable from one generation to the next):  they often took the first name of the father as a surname.  So Lotte's father first name was probably George, but his surname was probably his father's first name.   

Robas can be a Greek surname (from Greece), pronounced Rovas - accent on the last syllable.  The letter beta in the Greek alphabet is a v sound and often mistranscribed in English or Anglicised as a b.  In the Cypriot island dialect 'rovi' means 'pomegranate'.  It is probably an occupational name: he or his father may have owned a pomegranate orchard, or worked on one.  It could also be a variation of the surname Rouvas, of which there are a few in Cyprus today.  The online phone book yields 8.   

Gabriel can be a Greek name named after St. Gabriel the Archangel, pronounced [Gavril] or [Gavrilis].  It could also be Jewish (Gavri'el).  There is a Robas on the Shoah Memorial in Paris.

The evidence suggests your great-grandfather was Greek Orthodox, but we can't discount Roman Catholic, Anglican, Jewish or other.  Cyprus was/is a melting pot of races and religions. 

BMD registers in Cyprus were rarely held by municipal authorities in the late 19th century.  The records, if any, will be held by his local church.  Without any indication which part of Cyprus he came from or lived in, you are up against a Herculean task.  If he lived in the North (now Turkish), many church records were lost or destroyed during and after the 1974 war.  The Cyprus government has no access to any records currently held by the TRNC.   

Your best bet would be to post in Cyprus forums, and hope someone researching the same family comes forward, although native Greek-Cypriots and Turkish-Cypriots on the island are not known for investigating their ancestry as it is so difficult to track down official records.  There are also language barriers. 

You could try:

http://genforum.genealogy.com/cyprus/
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/
http://www.looking4kin.com/group/cyprus-genealogy
http://surnames.meaning-of-names.com/genealogy/cyprus/
http://support.genopro.com/Topic7655.aspx

Another thought: have you ever considered taking a DNA test?  This might narrow down a very specific geographical area, or give you further clues. 

Do visit Cyprus though.  Spring (May) and autumn (Oct) are the nicest times. 
Fide et Fortitudine - By fidelity and fortitude
"I force nae freen" - I force no friend and fear no foe

Offline Fide et Fortitudine

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 30 January 14 13:29 GMT (UK) »
PS, I suppose you've already tried Australian immigration records? 
http://www.immi.gov.au/media/research/research-family.htm

It is likely Gabriel Robas had family in Australia - perhaps an elder sibling/uncle/cousin who went out there before him (possibly attracted by the Gold Rush, as you say).  In the 19th C. Greek-Cypriots rarely travelled without having an existing contact at the destination, usually a family member. 

Most Greek-Cypriots in 1890s Australia were shopkeepers, based around Melbourne & Sydney. Australian trade directories could be another resource to investigate. 

I can see there was a Charles Robas Robas born in Parramatta, New South Wales, 1847, son of an Amelia Robas.  No father's name given.  https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XTCR-J51

Your g/f's middle name was Charles.  Coincidental, or...

I can see a John Robas on the Australian Passenger Arrival Lists, 1826-1922. 
http://search.ancestry.com.au/cgi-bin/sse.dll?gl=ROOT_CATEGORY&gsln=Robas&gsln_x=XO&gss=angs-c

You could also try contacting one of the many Australian-Cypriot community associations, who might have archives of 19th century residents.  There could not have been that many with the surname Robas/Rovas/Rouvas.  The 1933 Australian census shows 500 Cypriot-born residents.
http://www.mfa.gov.cy/mfa/highcom/highcomcanberra.nsf/community01_en/community01_en?OpenDocument





Fide et Fortitudine - By fidelity and fortitude
"I force nae freen" - I force no friend and fear no foe

Offline Roborhodie

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #6 on: Monday 09 February 15 07:52 GMT (UK) »
Thank you to all who have commented. Sorry, due to various reasons I have been away and could not respond.

Fide et Fortitudine - Thank you so much for your information. I am looking into the various comments. I understand that their religion was definitely Catholic as Lottie was still going to Mass in her later years in Bulawayo, Zimbabwe. Yes, there is a possibility that some family members went before though I have no records of this therefore no names, etc.

Giblet - per the comment by Jorose, she would have been in her twenties, so she could have had a child (children) in 1901.

I have heard that my great grandfather was deported from Australia - reason unknown.
Yes, Fide et Fortitudine, I have looked at the immigrations records.

Once I have looked through this information I will come back.

Thanks again.

Offline Fide et Fortitudine

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #7 on: Monday 09 February 15 11:58 GMT (UK) »
Hi again Trevor

If you are certain Lottie was a cradle Catholic - i.e. baptised as a baby, rather than a convert later in life - then her baptism and marriage to Gabriel may be recorded in the old Catholic parish registers of Cyprus, assuming they were married in the Catholic faith and not in the Orthodox Church, or any other church, depending on Gabriel's faith. 

All Catholic parishes of Cyprus belong to the Archdiocese of the Latin Patriarchate of Jerusalem.  Most of the older births, marriages & death records (19th & early 20th century) will be archived in Jerusalem.  You could try contacting the Diocesan office:  Latin Patriarchate of Jerusalem, P.O.B. 14152, 9114101 Jerusalem, Israel.  Tel:  (02) 628 23 23 / Tel: (02)  627 22 80 Fax: (02) 627  16  52  E-mail: chancellery@lpj.org or contact via their website: http://en.lpj.org/contact-us/

There may also be some genealogical records held by the Custody of the Holy Land (Custodia Terra Santae) - the Franciscan clergy are the custodians of the Catholic Church in Cyprus.  Contact: The Custody of the Holy Land, St. Saviour's Franciscan Monastery, PO Box 186, Jerusalem 91001, Israel.  Tel. +972 2 561 6266.  E-mail: custodia@custodia.org  Website:  http://www.custodia.org/

The good news for you is that there only 5 Catholic parishes in Cyprus, compared to hundreds if not thousands of Orthodox parishes, so this greatly narrows the field to your advantage. 

Lottie's name still sticks out at me.  Lotifia is not a Catholic name either any more than it is Greek Orthodox - there are no Christian saints called Lotifia and in the old days you couldn't get baptised or confirmed with a non-Christian name.  So it might be worth considering that she or one or both of her parents may have converted to Christianity from Islam or Judaism. 

She could have converted to Catholicism in Australia or Rhodesia, and not Cyprus.

It is highly unlikely she was baptised in any Christian church as Lotifia, either as a child or adult.  I put my money on her baptismal name being Charlotte or Carlotta, the feminine of Charles.  So your search enquiries should take that name variation into account.  Your grandfather's middle name was Charles, possibly named after his mother.   

Good luck with your investigations.  Keep at it. 









Fide et Fortitudine - By fidelity and fortitude
"I force nae freen" - I force no friend and fear no foe

Offline Fide et Fortitudine

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Re: Greek Cypriots from Cyprus to Australia to South Africa
« Reply #8 on: Monday 09 February 15 12:49 GMT (UK) »
PS, I've just noticed on the FS public death record for Lottie, https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-14685-23271-40?cc=1837900&wc=7118398 (29 June 1948), that her father's name & surname were left blank.  Only her mother's surname (maiden name?) is given as George.  Could it be that Lottie didn't know her father's name or that her parents were not married, hence no father's name? 

The death reg gives her age at death as 72, so estimated birth 1876, give or take a few years.  So this gives you a lead for birth or baptismal queries in Cyprus with the Diocese of Jerusalem. 

Do you have a copy of Lottie's Rhodesian death cert? Different from the public death register.  The DC might give you further clues. You can apply for it from the Registrar General in Harare.  There's a small fee of US$5 (5 working days' processing) or US$10 for urgent processing (24 hrs). See http://www.rg.gov.zw/services/birth - scroll down to 'Issuance of duplicate death certificate.' Contact: Registrar General's Department, Central Registry Office, Makombe Building, Harare, Zimbabwe.  Email: helpdesk@rg.gov.zw

---

Some historical background added, just for your interest:

By 1872, the population of the island [Cyprus] had risen to 144,000 comprising 44,000 Muslims and 100,000 Christians.  Many of the Muslims were secretly local Christians, called Linobambaki, that were pretending to be Muslims in the day and were becoming Christians again in the night. This was done in order to avoid the extra taxation and other discrimination against Christians, from the Ottomans.

In the aftermath of the Russo-Turkish War (1877–1878) and the Congress of Berlin, Cyprus was leased to the British Empire which de facto took over its administration in 1878 (though, in terms of sovereignty, Cyprus remained a de jure Ottoman territory until 5 November 1914, together with Egypt and Sudan) in exchange for guarantees that Britain would use the island as a base to protect the Ottoman Empire against possible Russian aggression.

The island would serve Britain as a key military base for its colonial routes. By 1906, when the Famagusta harbour was completed, Cyprus was a strategic naval outpost overlooking the Suez Canal, the crucial main route to India which was then Britain's most important overseas possession. Following the outbreak of World War I and the decision of the Ottoman Empire to join the war on the side of the Central Powers, on 5 November 1914 the British Empire formally annexed Cyprus. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyprus#Cyprus_under_the_Ottoman_Empire

 
Fide et Fortitudine - By fidelity and fortitude
"I force nae freen" - I force no friend and fear no foe