Author Topic: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908  (Read 5420 times)

Offline stevehyland

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FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« on: Wednesday 15 January 14 01:26 GMT (UK) »
My grandmother was born "illegitimately" in Belper in 1908. 

Is it likely to be possible to track down a father's name?
Hyland, Casey and Tyrrell (Meath and Westmeath, Ireland)

Kelly and Casey (Dublin, Ireland)

Kearney/Carney/Carnie (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire Scotland), Porteous (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire, Scotland)

Whitehead (London, Middlesex, England),

Awege (Prussia), Martin (Dover, Cornwall, England),

Stuart (Derbyshire, England),

Offline Ruskie

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 02:00 GMT (UK) »
Sometimes yes, often no ...
Do you have her birth certificate? Presumably no father is named?
If she was baptised do you have the church record of this? May name 'reputed' father.
Did her mother marry and have more children? This man may have been father of your grandmother and any subsequent children. Difficult to prove though.
Does she have any middle names which may give a clue to who her father was?
DNA testing can sometimes be used to narrow down likely parentage. Complicated and not foolproof.
Of course, something to consider is that there would also be cases where even the mother may not know who the father of her baby is ....
Just a few thoughts - others with more experience on the subject may be able to assist further.



Offline stevehyland

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 02:41 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for your quick response.  I thought it might be difficult if not impossible...frustrating.

Father is not named in b/c, and no record of ch baptism (although there may have been one). 

Mother married a year later and had two children who took their father's name.  My g/mother's surname remained unchanged as her mother's maiden name.  No middle names.

Rgds

Steve
Hyland, Casey and Tyrrell (Meath and Westmeath, Ireland)

Kelly and Casey (Dublin, Ireland)

Kearney/Carney/Carnie (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire Scotland), Porteous (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire, Scotland)

Whitehead (London, Middlesex, England),

Awege (Prussia), Martin (Dover, Cornwall, England),

Stuart (Derbyshire, England),

Offline Ruskie

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 05:15 GMT (UK) »
If mother married only a year later her husband may well be the father. Sometimes surnames changed, sometimes not, and sometimes both birth surname and 'adopted' surnames were used interchangeably.
Are you in touch with descendants of your grandmother's 'siblings'? I am wondering if DNA testing may be feasible in this case. You could always explain the scenario and ask the question on the DNA board:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?board=432.0
Are there any elderly relatives you can ask who may have heard talk in the family of her father's identity?
Are there any clues in her place of birth? Was she born at home or in a mother's home or some such place which may hold records?
Sorry I can't think of anything else to suggest.


Offline stevehyland

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 05:33 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for that...I'll give it some thought.

Steve
Hyland, Casey and Tyrrell (Meath and Westmeath, Ireland)

Kelly and Casey (Dublin, Ireland)

Kearney/Carney/Carnie (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire Scotland), Porteous (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire, Scotland)

Whitehead (London, Middlesex, England),

Awege (Prussia), Martin (Dover, Cornwall, England),

Stuart (Derbyshire, England),

Offline giblet

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 06:09 GMT (UK) »
Just a thought  ;) If you can somehow find out if they lived at the same address at the time of birth.

Also have you checked the 1911 census? Not sure if that would help any or not but maybae the first child might be noted as his child or a step child. Just another thought ;D

Offline tedscout

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 06:56 GMT (UK) »
Who registered the birth?

I have 3 certs all illegitimate all the same mother and the same man registered all the births.

Turns out due to a will she couldn't remarry. Some of the death certs of the children name the person who registered the birth as the father.

Just food for thought.
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Offline Sarco

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 15 January 14 23:55 GMT (UK) »
Doesn't appear to have been mentioned so far but does she name her natural father on a marriage certificate? Supposing, of course, she subsequently married.
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Offline stevehyland

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Re: FATHERS OF "ILLEGITIMATE" CHILDREN 1908
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 16 January 14 00:17 GMT (UK) »
Thanks to all for taking the time to respond to my question. 

I'm reluctant to go down the DNA path, because it's (in my view at least, and for various reasons) unlikely that her "stepfather" was her biological father.  Thus I'd be paying a fair bit of money to probably prove the negative, even if I could identify his relatives and convince them to collaborate with me from 13 000 miles away.

In relation to my grandmother's marriage certificate, that's an interesting issue.  She travelled to Australia by ship alone aged 16-17.  She married my grandfather who was about 13 years older about 5 years later.  In the circumstances, it was unsurprising that she had a false name for her father and a false (older) age on her marriage certificate.  That made even tracking her down difficult.

Again, many thanks to you all. 
Hyland, Casey and Tyrrell (Meath and Westmeath, Ireland)

Kelly and Casey (Dublin, Ireland)

Kearney/Carney/Carnie (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire Scotland), Porteous (Fermanagh/Donegal, Ireland, Renfrewshire, Scotland)

Whitehead (London, Middlesex, England),

Awege (Prussia), Martin (Dover, Cornwall, England),

Stuart (Derbyshire, England),