Author Topic: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again  (Read 20754 times)

Offline Ruskie

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #18 on: Thursday 22 May 14 07:52 BST (UK) »
[MINOR PROBLEM:
When we first started this Nathaniel obsession, we used to go back to our old posts and make amendments, most importantly to the timeline - sometimes just adding one or two small facts as we discovered them - regularly updating it.

NOW, we are unable to do this as we can only amend our own post for 24 hours.

After this time, we have to request that a moderator makes changes on our behalf. Depending on how much we find and how many changes we require, this will give a lot of extra work to the mod and also may cause difficulties explaining to the mod what changes we would like, exact wording, where changes need to go, etc. So something which would take us a minute to change ourselves has to go through a third party.

I think that re-posting the entire time line when a small change is made, is not practical and would make the thread cumbersome and longer than it needs to be.

It is kindof nice to have the timeline on page 1 for everyone to refer to. Maybe we will just see how it goes, and hope that we find plenty of new info which we will have to trouble a mod to add.  ;D]

Offline deb usa

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 22 May 14 12:05 BST (UK) »
Great job, Ruskie!

I didn't know that we could only amend/add to a post within 24 hours. Perhaps, if we find new things for the timeline, we could post them in bold red so it's easily noticeable when scrolling through the pages. (I'm optimistic that we will find pages of info!  ;D)

Can you add the 1851 directory?

I need to find the link to the diary again ...it may be worth rereading. I think I may enjoy doing that :)

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline deb usa

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #20 on: Thursday 22 May 14 13:57 BST (UK) »
Just found this and donít really know what to think of it. Does the electoral reg. below refer to Nat snr. or jnr.?

1881 census
48 Essex Rd, Islington Green Nth
Nathaniel 54 accountant
Sarah wife 55
Nathaniel son 24 undertaker
Sarah daur 22
John son 21 compositor
Henry son 17 builder's labourer

According to the electoral registers of 1881 this is a description of the residence : Although Iím not sure what all of this means as both Nats are at Essex Rd! (Description is in columns)

Parish of St Mary, Islington, Ward # 8 Ė St Peterís
LODGERS
Name of Voters in full, surname being  first:
#39208 Nathaniel Bryceson/
Description of rooms occupied and whether furnished or not:
 breakfast palour, kitchen and bedroom, ground floor, unfurnished/
Street, Lane or other place, and number (if any) of house in which lodgings are situate:
 155 Packington Street, Islington/
Amount of rent paid:
 8s. 6d. per week/
Name and address of landlord or other persons to whom rent is paid:
William Harris 155 Packington st

Perhaps NB jnr. moved out of Essex Street after the census was taken.
 
Just for interests sake Öthe description of homes/rooms NB lived in:
Charlton Place
1894:
Nathaniel Bryceson, 3 rooms, 2 ground floor one basement, unfurnished, Mr Stangroom same address

And Warren Street :
1901
Nathaniel Bryceson , 1 room and kitchen, first floor, unfurnished, 42 Warren Street, Mr Stangroom at same address.

There are 2 other addresses that appear for Nathaniel Bryceson which do not come up during the censuses. (not sure if they are for NB snr. or jnr.)
1902; 32 Crouch Hill, dwelling house (service), rooms over shop
1902: 7 Avenell rd, dwelling house (part service) (successive), then a column with 32 Crouch hill (rooms over Shop) and 7 Avenell rd.

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Ruskie

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #21 on: Thursday 22 May 14 14:19 BST (UK) »
Hi Deb,

Firstly I have to clarify that the timeline has not had anything added to it since Matthew Ward's death details (if I remember back that far  ::)), so I do have some work to do.

I think your idea of adding new facts as they are found in red is an excellent idea. The 24 hour time limit in which you can make changes to your posts was introduced during 'the changes'. I believe it was to stop people amending posts at a later date and the entire thread no longer making sense as bits might be missing. I can understand that reasoning but it is difficult if, like us, you want to add something. I would feel bad bothering a moderator to ask them to do this for us. (and if they added it incorrectly I would feel even worse asking them to change it  :-[).

Very interesting about the residences - is that all from the electoral registers? Did you find it on Ancestry?

Don't get too far ahead of me Deb - I have lots of catching up to do and it's already past my bedtime.  ;D  :(


Offline deb usa

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #22 on: Thursday 22 May 14 14:29 BST (UK) »
Hi Ruskie

Yep everything is from Ancestry. There seems to be a lot of new records added to the London indexes.

Some time or other I'm going to reread the diary ...  :D

Sleep tight!
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Ruskie

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #23 on: Friday 23 May 14 00:41 BST (UK) »
Am now working on a summary of what we are still looking for, and also what needs to be added to the timeline.  :)

Deb, regarding this info you posted:

Just for interests sake Öthe description of homes/rooms NB lived in:
Charlton Place
1894:
Nathaniel Bryceson, 3 rooms, 2 ground floor one basement, unfurnished, Mr Stangroom same address
And Warren Street :
1901
Nathaniel Bryceson , 1 room and kitchen, first floor, unfurnished, 42 Warren Street, Mr Stangroom at same address.


Remember that Mr Stangroom is his daughter's husband and he died at their address in Dempsey St.

Also, as I go over the previous 'revisted' thread and the article published in 1919 about Nathaniel, it says he had 2 tons of books, so him dabbling in bookselling does not surprise me.  :)

Offline deb usa

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #24 on: Friday 23 May 14 01:12 BST (UK) »
Hi Ruskie,

I spent the whole morning going around in circles and really achieving nothing except my happiness to be revisiting Nat's diary again.

Unfortunately it seems that there is no way to view the diary , however there seems to be many references to it in other books.

see here:
www.rootschat.com/links/0ze0

I started reading our earlier threads again ...I wish we had copied and pasted each diary entry on the day we were posting unfortunately we only have snippets.

In thread 3 near the end Ann and Nat go walking in Charlotte street (I think) to FITZROY SQUARE.   I wonder if this is the same Charlotte Street where NB jnr. lived with his family. There is also mention of Crouch Hill. I have forgotten so much of what occurred.

I remember that Stangroom was his son-in-law.

Do you remember who Mrs. Skiriker turned out to be? I know she was Bunyan's grandaughter or gr granddaughter but what was her name?

How fun is this?

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline drykid

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #25 on: Friday 23 May 14 08:03 BST (UK) »
Glad to see this discussion still continuing  :)

You can read the first ten months of the diary via archive.org still:

https://web.archive.org/web/20101217000837/http://www.westminster.gov.uk/services/libraries/archives/victorian-clerk/archive/

For some reason archive.org never picked up the November and December pages, although it's possible they might be on there hidden away somewhere.  But if all else fails then maybe Westminster archive could supply us with the files?  They were very helpful in the past iirc.

The news about Nathaniel owning a bookstore is fascinating, although I'm surprised a bit that he would've had the money to do this?  It seems like it would be an expensive endeavour.  I'm also a bit confused about the idea of there being a shop or dwellings in Percy Passage since from the pictures I can see online it's literally a narrow passageway between two streets?  Maybe it used to be wider.

Offline deb usa

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Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson Revisited Again
« Reply #26 on: Friday 23 May 14 12:37 BST (UK) »
Hi drykid  :)

Thanks so much for the link to the diary!!!

Percy Passage seems to link Charlotte Street and Rathbone Street. The directory definitely says Percy Pas. and not street. As you say, it's very narrow .
I just looked at google maps again and when 'standing' in Rathbone Street looking down Percy passage there seems to be some bricked up windows ...perhaps in Nat's time there were entrances to shops in the passage.

Looking at it from the Charlotte Street side into the passage there also looks to be possible side entrance ways.

ah ha ...a picture from Rathbone Street .. bricked up windows?
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk