Author Topic: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels  (Read 5021 times)

Offline Westy11

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A tall ask I fear but nonetheless I have always been amazed what others have been able to achieve on Rootschat Forum.

I am hoping for some assistance to locate the marriage details between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton.

William Sanderson a civil engineer, made a Will on 24 Feb 1868: he was in Brussels at the time.  In the Will he notes that he is off to India in the service of the British Government.  William notes ....I give to my wife Frances, daughter of the late William Henry Pilton of Kennington Surrey and sister to Madame Rochard of Brussels. ....

Frances was born in Kennington Surrey.  It is likely that Frances [Fanny] was in Brussels and that William and Frances married between 26 Sept 1865 and 24 Feb 1868.

Williams father was Henry Sanderson deceased in 1849 and a civil engineer.  Frances father was a brick maker.

Westy11

Offline leen

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 15 March 15 14:03 GMT (UK) »
can’t find a marriage for Frances in Brussels, but there’s a birth of a son William Joseph Sanderson born 4th  May 1868 Brussels
and the marriage of Harriette Pilton (Frances’ sister) with Simon Jacques Rochard  : 2th July 1863 Brussels
on Familysearch   https://familysearch.org/search/image/index#uri=https://familysearch.org/recapi/sord/collection/1482191/waypoints

birth William Joseph Sanderson   http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ey9/   (cert n° 2159)

marriage Harriette Pilton     http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ey7/  (cert n° 858)

marriage annexes    http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ey8/    (image 501 up to image 519 (among others the baptism cert of Harriette and death cert of her father)
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Offline Westy11

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 15 March 15 23:46 GMT (UK) »
Hello  leen

That is simply amazing and I thank you for that.... Now I just have to find someone who speaks French [ is it French on William Joseph's birth record].

Nonetheless thank you so much for your assistance! :)

Westy11

Offline Svenja

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 21 March 15 00:51 GMT (UK) »
Hi

Here is someone who speaks French and this is the text in French and English:


Cinq Mai, mil huit cent soixante-huit (1868), heure de midi à été dressé, après constatation, par nous, officier de l’état civil de la ville de Bruxelles, l’Acte de Naissance de William Joseph Sanderson, né le quatre de ce mois à sept heures du matin, rue des douze apôtres, N. 16, 1 R, fils de William Sanderson, Ingénieur, né à Londres et de Fanny Pilton née à Londres, conjointes, domiciliés é Londres (Angleterre).
Sur la déclaration de Jean Baptiste Simon, accoucheur, agé de quarante-sept ans, domicilié place de la Chapelle Nr 3, 3e D.
En présence de Jean Philippe Hauser, professeur, âgé de trente-six ans et de Narcisse Bourbon, professeur, âgé de trente-cinq ans, domiciliés en cette ville.


5th Mai 1868 at noon, I the registrar of Brussels, have written this record after determination. Birth record of William Joseph Sanderson, born on the 4th of this month at seven o’clock in the morning, at twelve Apostle Street number 16, son of William Sanderson, Engineer, born in London and of Fanny Pilton, born in London, married, resident in London, England.
Declaration made by Jean Baptiste Simon, who was present at the birth, aged fourty-seven, resident place of the Chapel number 3, 3e D.
Also present at the registrar’s office were Jean Philippe Hauser, Professor, aged thirty-six, and Narcisse Bourbon, Professor, aged thirty-five , both residents in this city.


Regards
Svenja
Switzerland + USA: Iten, Letter, Besmer, Mathis, Meier, Schwager, Eisenring
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Germany/Jewish: Bachmann, Bamberger, Straus(s), Kraus(s), Lehmann, Gutmann
I can read and write German, English and French.
I can translate from Italian and Latin to the above languages.


Offline Westy11

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 21 March 15 01:25 GMT (UK) »
Hello Svenja

Thank you so much for the translation.  Just superb.

Kind regards

Westy11

Offline Svenja

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 21 March 15 13:18 GMT (UK) »
Hi

This is the French text of the marriage of the sister in Brussels:


L’an mil huit cent soixante-trois, le deux du mois de Juillet, à onze heures du matin, devant nous, Henri Vandermeeren, officier de l’état civil de la ville de Bruxelles, ont comparu en la Maison communale, en séance publique:

Simon Jacques Rochard, artiste peintre, né à Paris le vingt-huit décembre mil sept cent quatre-vingt-huit, domicilié à Bruxelles, rue des douze apôtres No 23, veuf de Henriette Françoise Désiré Petitjean, décédée le onze avril mil huit cent soixante-trois, fils majeur de Réné Rochard, décédé et de Marie Madeleine Calon, profession et domicile inconnus, d’une part

et de Harriette Pilton, sans profession, née à Londres, le neuf juillet mil huit cent vingt-neuf, domiciliée à Bruxelles même rue No 23, fille majeure de feu William Henri Pilton et de Susanne Anne Stevens, rentière, domiciliée à Londres, consentante par acte, d’autre part.

Les contractants déclarent avoir arrêté leurs conventions matrimoniales devant Martie Gheude, notaire à Bruxelles, le deux juillet.

L’époux déclare sous la foi du serment que la mère es absente sans nouvelles depuis vingt-deux ans, la quelle déclaration est aussi certifiée sous serment par les témoins. L’épouse déclare que le nom de famille de sa mère est Stevens, laquelle déclaration est aussi certifiée par les témoins.

En présence de Auguste Charles Swartk/Swastk, Banquier, âgé de vingt-six ans, domicilié à Saint Josse ten Noode, Emile De Moors, Banquier, âgé de quarante-six ans, Pierre Martin Gheude, notaire, âgé de trente-huit ans, et Jean Gheude, employé, âgé de trente-six ans, tous trois domiciliés à Bruxelles.


Regards
Svenja
Switzerland + USA: Iten, Letter, Besmer, Mathis, Meier, Schwager, Eisenring
Germany/Bavaria: Beinberger, Painberger, Schleich, Pfeiffer, Weber, Schelle
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Germany/Franken: Weidner, Reuss, Beifuss, Trenkert, Drenkert, Drenkart
Germany/Jewish: Bachmann, Bamberger, Straus(s), Kraus(s), Lehmann, Gutmann
I can read and write German, English and French.
I can translate from Italian and Latin to the above languages.

Offline Svenja

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 21 March 15 13:21 GMT (UK) »
Hi

And this is the English translation of the same marriage record:


In the year 1863, the 2nd of the month July, at 11 o’clock in the morning, at the registrar of Brussels, Henri Vandermeeren, appeared in the council office for a public session:

Simon Jacques Rochard, painter, born in Paris on the 28th December 1788, resident in Brussels, twelve apostles Street number 23, widower of Henriette Françoise Désiré Petitjean, died on the 11th April 1863, son of full age of the deceased Réné Rochard and of Marie Madeleine Calon, occupation and residence unknown, on the first part

and Harriette Pilton, without occupation, born in London on the 9th July 1829, resident in Brussels on the same street number 23, daughter of full age of the deceased William Henri Pilton and of Susanne Anne Stevens, pensioner, consenting, resident in London, on the other part

The contractors declared to have layed down the conventions of the marriage at the notary Martie Gheude in Brussels on the 2nd July.

The bridegroom made the sworn statement that his mother has been absent without any news for 22 years, this declaration was also certified by the witnesses. The bride made the sworn statement that the surname of her mother is Stevens, this declaration was also certified by the witnesses.

In presence of Auguste Charles Swartk or Swastk, banker, aged twenty six, resident in Saint Josse ten Noode (not sure), Emile De Moors, banker, aged forty six, Pierre Martin Gheude, notary, aged thirty eight, and Jean Gheude, employee, aged thirty six, all three resident in Brussels.


Regards
Svenja
Switzerland + USA: Iten, Letter, Besmer, Mathis, Meier, Schwager, Eisenring
Germany/Bavaria: Beinberger, Painberger, Schleich, Pfeiffer, Weber, Schelle
Germany/Bavaria: Boeck, Rauch, Pracht, Sporer, Schorer, Mahler, Grotz
Germany/Franken: Weidner, Reuss, Beifuss, Trenkert, Drenkert, Drenkart
Germany/Jewish: Bachmann, Bamberger, Straus(s), Kraus(s), Lehmann, Gutmann
I can read and write German, English and French.
I can translate from Italian and Latin to the above languages.

Offline Westy11

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 21 March 15 13:57 GMT (UK) »
Hello Svenja

That is really marvelous and I am so appreciative. :)

Can I impose on you for one further favour please????  If possible is there anychance you can find any record of William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton's son William Joseph Sanderson born 4 May 1868 in Brussels???

I have been unable to locate what became of Frances and her son after her husband William died in India in 1872.  It seems that Frances and the child may have stayed in Brussels and she and her sister and their little ones may have looked after each other whilst William was away.

Even if you are unable to assist further I am genuinely thankful for your efforts.

Westy11

Offline Svenja

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Re: Marriage between William Sanderson and Frances [Fanny] Pilton poss Brussels
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 21 March 15 14:18 GMT (UK) »
Hi

Simon Jacques Rochard was a famous portrait painter as you can read here:

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Jacques_Rochard

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Rochard,_Simon_Jacques_%28DNB00%29

Regards
Svenja
Switzerland + USA: Iten, Letter, Besmer, Mathis, Meier, Schwager, Eisenring
Germany/Bavaria: Beinberger, Painberger, Schleich, Pfeiffer, Weber, Schelle
Germany/Bavaria: Boeck, Rauch, Pracht, Sporer, Schorer, Mahler, Grotz
Germany/Franken: Weidner, Reuss, Beifuss, Trenkert, Drenkert, Drenkart
Germany/Jewish: Bachmann, Bamberger, Straus(s), Kraus(s), Lehmann, Gutmann
I can read and write German, English and French.
I can translate from Italian and Latin to the above languages.