Author Topic: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain  (Read 1180 times)

Offline McdonaldMckay

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McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« on: Sunday 18 October 15 22:00 BST (UK) »
Hi,
I wondered if anyone had info or suggestions of further places to look for info on William Mcdonald born 1835 in either Ferintosh or Knockbain. I, and other family researchers, have been unable to find a record of his birth as he was illegitimate. On his wedding certificate his parents are listed as Alexander McDonald and Ann Mckay. However on his death certificate, their surnames are the other way round. I can't find him on any census before 1850 when he then moved to Aberdeenshire and later married Helen Buchan. We have lots of info on him after this but are really keen to find any info on him prior to this.
Thanks in advance.

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Offline Rosinish

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #1 on: Monday 19 October 15 00:13 BST (UK) »
Who was William living with in 1851.

Have you been searching for William or his mother Ann in 1841 as he may be down as Wm. rather than William i.e. harder to find.

Have you also tried variants of surname Mc/Mac/M' & suffix of "Kie"

Did William sign his name on marriage or was it an "X" - his mark.

Have you looked for a death for his mother.

Who was the informant on Williams death.

The details given on his marriage are more likely to be correct as the info. was given by William himself.

By the time William married, his mother may have been married to someone else (Alexander) rather than his true father but used his step-father's name.

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie, MacDonald, MacInnes, MacIntyre, MacKinnon, Steele, Walker

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, MacKinnon, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

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Offline McdonaldMckay

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 31 October 15 09:57 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for your reply.
Sorry, my first post was wrong. I can't find him for definite on any census before 1861. There are plenty of William Mcdonalds but I can't be sure they are him, especially as he was most likely to be working as an agricultural labourer and there are plenty of them.
I can't find any Ann Mckay living with a William Mcdonald so I'm thinking it's possible he went to stay somewhere else. I also can't find her death certificate because I have no info on her other than a possible region where she lived and a possible name.
He states that he was born in Ferintosh in several census and also Knockbain on one but that doesn't make it easier to narrow down because they don't seem to appear on any census for him.
Thanks for your suggestions though! Looks like it's destined to be a dead end. Why did he have to be a Mcdonald! If only his name had been something really unusual!

Offline Citizen Smith

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 31 October 15 11:02 GMT (UK) »
There's a listing on the index for the OPRs on Scotland's People for a William Mackay born 1833 in the Parish of Urqhuart & Logie Wester (Ferintosh on the Black Isle was part of this parish). His parents are listed as Alexander Mackay and Isabel Bayne.

Let's assume this is your William for the moment. If he was illegitimate, downloading the OPR might confirm that. It could mean he is listed on the 1841 Census as Mackay, Bayne or McDonald (or variant spellings of all of these!). Perhaps Isabel married Alexander Mackay and then went on to marry an Alexander McDonald.

I've attached the index listing I downloaded so that you can follow it up.
Kirkcaldy and Dysart: Kinnaird, Brown, McDougall, Page
Burntisland: Brown, Chalmers
Perth: Low
Donegal: Browne, O'Donnell
Montrose: Allardice
Dorset: Allen

Offline Citizen Smith

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 31 October 15 11:14 GMT (UK) »
The Bayne/Mackay family are listed on Family Search as having a number of children so I could be completely wrong about this being your William as it doesn't fit with the illegitimacy.

How sure are you that he was illegitmate?

Sarah
Kirkcaldy and Dysart: Kinnaird, Brown, McDougall, Page
Burntisland: Brown, Chalmers
Perth: Low
Donegal: Browne, O'Donnell
Montrose: Allardice
Dorset: Allen

Offline McdonaldMckay

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 01 November 15 13:05 GMT (UK) »
Hi,
Thanks for this. I'll have a look into it. I get confused about the areas and which bits are near where in a census etc, especially when he seems to have come from so small a place.
Its his death certificate that records him as illegitimate. Thats where the surnames get muddled up and are different from his marriage certificate. His son was the informant so Im guessing he would have known that but possibly did get the surnames muddled up. It clearly states there that he is illegitimate. This isnt mentioned on his marriage certificate but that wouldnt be recorded anyway would it? It just says they were both deceased at the time of his marriage.

Offline Citizen Smith

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 01 November 15 13:18 GMT (UK) »
Did he die in Scotland.

I don't think I've come across illegitimacy being recorded on death certificates in Scotland, only on birth certificates (of which I've found quite a few illegitimate ancestors). Although, if only the mother's name is recorded on a death cert, you can draw your own conclusions.

Regarding marriage certificates, don't believe everything you read. It was commonplace to lie, or to repeat a lie which had been told to you, to cover up illegitimacy. So you often find grandparents or other relatives recorded as parents or invented fathers popping up to conceal secrets.

I'm intrigued by William and feel your pain researching such a common and commonly misspelled name as my own tree is full of Browns on multiple branches!
Kirkcaldy and Dysart: Kinnaird, Brown, McDougall, Page
Burntisland: Brown, Chalmers
Perth: Low
Donegal: Browne, O'Donnell
Montrose: Allardice
Dorset: Allen

Offline Rosinish

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 01 November 15 13:45 GMT (UK) »
This is a very confusing thread not only with names but places too.

Not sure if this will be of any help but dating in these may help to locate William as names of places/ parishes/areas seem to have changed over the years?

https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Knockbain,_Ross_and_Cromarty,_Scotland

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferintosh,_Black_Isle

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie, MacDonald, MacInnes, MacIntyre, MacKinnon, Steele, Walker

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, MacKinnon, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline McdonaldMckay

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Re: McDonald/Mckay 1835 Ferintosh or Knockbain
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 01 November 15 15:19 GMT (UK) »
Yes, he died in Leochel Cushnie, Alford. His death certificate states that Alexander McKay is the "reputed father" and then theres a scribble at the side which has obviously been added in later saying that he is illegitimate.
I suspect that he perhaps did lie on the marriage certificate because his wifes father was a minister! I wonder if being illegitimate wouldnt have gone down too well with his father in law.
But it still leaves me the question of which of his parents were McDonald and which were McKay. I thought at first that he would have kept his mothers name and so she would be Ann McDonald but then i have discovered several other relatives or children who were given the names of their fathers, even though they were illegitimate, so i cant rely on that either. I think i will follow up the Mckay route for him. I cant find his birth as a McDonald anyway so maybe its possible he changed his surname himself when he moved from Ross-Shire into Aberdeenshire.
Thanks for the place name links as well. I will have a look at them and hopefully they will help me pick out possible census matches a bit more easily.