Author Topic: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?  (Read 48014 times)

Offline janeo

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 29 May 16 22:38 BST (UK) »
I have Asian .I'm Smith /Elliott /Gray /Wiltshire .Butler /Boswell paternal and Wilson /Burnside /Rhodes maternal .I have a small % which surprised me I thought i would have a lot more ,but it does not work that way .I'm glad i took the test ,found lots of distant cousins and several 3rd cousins ..
Smith, Wilson ,Elliot ,Ratchford Burnside ,

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Offline sallyyorks

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #10 on: Monday 30 May 16 11:25 BST (UK) »

Here is his message:

" ... You may or may not show a small South Asian percentage on your autosomal report, but that hasn't as much meaning to me, what does have more meaning to me is matching existing Romany participants and there are multiple Romany whom have done the autosomal test. I do not put a lot of faith in to the admixture population reports because those reports are grossly lop sided towards the European population, so it may find some percentages to certain populations like the Romany, or may not find any at all.

I know of male Romany "Rom" whom are in Y Haplogroup H1a - M82 which is clearly South Asian in origin, but their autosomal reports shows zero percent South Asian.
Because of admixture, the mixing of Romany and Europeans over the last 1000 to 2000 years, Romany on an autosomal genetic level are more European today then South Asian. What has more meaning to me personally is the DNA matches you will have because that is really what that test is more about, finding related family members whom share autosomal DNA with you. The autosomal test works exactly as it was intended, I found two cousins through that test, one is my paternal grand mothers nephew, and one is my grand aunt's grand son, so the test is best if used for it's primary purpose, to find related family members and not 100% rely on what the admixture report has to say because those admixture reports are heavily biased towards the European population.

This is a good point.
I think it is also true that 2 full siblings can take an autosomal test each, but have different results. So one might show some South Asian % and the other show none at all? Even though they both share the same ancestry. Also, as already said, the Romany travelled through many countries, settling in some for a considerable time, intermarrying with locals and then some moving on again

I have a very unusual surname that is on the same branch but in 2 different families (if that makes sense). A spelling variant of this unusual name appears as Y haplo group H in this Romany dna project.
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Romnchel?iframe=yresults
The families who marry into this unusual name, are not obviously Romany in the 19thc, (apart from a distant cousin in caravans with Romany families), but when you go back further, some of them do seem to be itinerant metal workers and they do seem to intermarry over generations.

I haven't taken a dna test myself (don't know where to start?), just noticed others with the same name who have. By Googling uncommon surnames, looking at the dna results/project and where their ancestors came from. Though I do realise that just because they share a surname and come from the same area, this is not definate proof that they are related. But you might get lucky and find that the person who did the tests ancestor (who is named and dated in the project),  is somewhere on your own family tree

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Offline Regorian

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #11 on: Monday 30 May 16 12:08 BST (UK) »
I don't believe there is any mystery remaining re the origin of the Romany's. A search of wikipedia will reveal all. There are many websites. Relatively recently a professor of linguistics from Oxford University spoke to as many Romany's as possible asking them about their language. From that he realised that their origins were Indian. However, from the websites, it appears that their origins may have been understood 150 years ago.

Southern Asia means southern India and then they migrated to northern India. This was 1,000 years ago or more. They were entertainers, singers and dancers I think. They were invited to perform for the Persian court and were there for some years. Then they were banished and hence the migrations to all over Europe and beyond.

They first appeared in England in the 1400's, can't remember the exact year but it was recorded. Being swarthy they attracted the name Egyptians (shortened to gypsies). Later Romany's because one of the routes into Europe was via Romania/Rumania/Romania.

They were due to be banished from England in the time of 'Bloody' Queen Mary but it may not have happened (The Jews were long gone). I remember reading a quote from Queen Mary 'that they could stay if they weren't naughty'. Evidently, she shared the view of modern police that Romany's/gypsies are just a pack of thieves.     

 
Griffiths Llandogo, Mitcheltroy, Mon. and Whitchurch Here (Also Edwards),  18th C., Griffiths FoD 19th Century.

Offline janicejo

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #12 on: Monday 30 May 16 15:25 BST (UK) »
Regorian - you can have your DNA tested at Ancestry.com, wait till there's a sale and save some money.  Once you get the results, transfer the DNA results to Gedmatch.  That site has tools where you can find even very small amounts of South Asian DNA.  If you don't have any, you're still Romany because it's a culture as well as an ethnic group.  With Ancestry you're more likely to find more distant cousins than other sites.  Just be prepared to have a lot of them freak out at the mention of Romany Gypsy and stop talking to you.
     I've read articles about Romany origins, some say that our ancestors were warriors and the forgers of weapons and other metal objects.  They were recruited to fight a war somewhere between Iran and Pakistan, then they began migrating westward.  How they came to Britain I don't know, but I also have about 1% North African DNA, so maybe we did go thru Egypt.

Offline Regorian

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #13 on: Monday 30 May 16 15:30 BST (UK) »
I don't need any DNA testing, my name places me and mine in Britain for thousands of years. 
Griffiths Llandogo, Mitcheltroy, Mon. and Whitchurch Here (Also Edwards),  18th C., Griffiths FoD 19th Century.

Offline janicejo

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #14 on: Monday 30 May 16 15:54 BST (UK) »
Oh I'm sorry, I had you mixed up with another poster (Sally York) who was asking about DNA testing.  It's a personal choice whether one wants to check out their DNA or not. 

Offline Regorian

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #15 on: Monday 30 May 16 16:19 BST (UK) »
No problem. Hope you are tracing your ancestors to the extent that most of us can. I'm stuck at 1740. Not my fault, the entries are just not there. I still feel a failure.
Griffiths Llandogo, Mitcheltroy, Mon. and Whitchurch Here (Also Edwards),  18th C., Griffiths FoD 19th Century.

Offline janicejo

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #16 on: Monday 30 May 16 16:40 BST (UK) »
1740?  That's great!!  My own surname line, Johnston, I haven't been able to trace before 1854!  I did DNA testing to see if I could figure out who the father of my great-grandfather Peter Johnston (b.1854 Fyvie, Abd, Scotland) was.  I have his name James, but Abd. is full of James Johnston's.  So, I did DNA testing.  My closest DNA relatives with Johnston are from Nova Scotia and Virginia!!  Now I have wild theories of  American colonists in Virginia, being loyalists and going to Canada after the Rev. war.  Then one of them went to Abd. and became a farm servant? 
     But I've had some great success with DNA - my Scottish great-grandmother's tree confirmed to 1600,   My English great-grandmother's Roberts line to 1790, and most awesome my Romany line, which had been hidden from my father and his sibs by his grandmother - her family moved to Canada in 1912 and the words Romany or Gypsy were never spoken again.

Offline Regorian

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Re: Romany DNA - what would you expect to see?
« Reply #17 on: Monday 30 May 16 16:45 BST (UK) »
Quite an achievement Janicejo, well done.
Griffiths Llandogo, Mitcheltroy, Mon. and Whitchurch Here (Also Edwards),  18th C., Griffiths FoD 19th Century.