Emma Spruce nee Hyatt

[smudwhisk]

Following on from last Friday's very helpful discussion on another member of the Hyatt family in New South Wales, I was wondering whether any kind RCers could cast their eye over this information and possibly help me.   On this particular line, I've not got any issues with posting all the information I have, unlike last week .

An Emma Hyatt married Herbert Spruce at Raymond Terrace Weslyan in November 1887.  The entry contains no parent's details and as far as I can see, none of the witnesses are members of the Hyatt family.  However, when she died in 1907, her death certificate lists her father as John Height and her birth place as Tamworth in 1869.

As far as I can see there was only one Emma Hyatt birth registered in NSW that year or adjoining years.  Emma Maria Hyatt the daughter of John Hyatt and Emma Birth (who had married in 1867 at Hartley St John) was born 30 April 1869 at Krui River in the District of Merriwa.  John and Emma had one further child, John, whose birth was registered in 1873 in Murrindi District.

I can find no further trace of John Hyatt junior and the only trace of Emma Birch I have found is a newspaper entry in 1877 from Trove.  Her mother placed an entry in the Australian Town & Country Journal on 6 Jan 1877 (found on Trove) saying "if this should meet the eye of Emma Hyatt, maiden name Emma Burch (sic), last heard of at Liverpool or Breeza(?) Plains, write to your mother .."  John Hyatt senior died at McLeod's Creek nee Drake in 1903 with his brother Richard the informant on his death certificate.  Richard listed his brother as being single with no children.  John may have been up at McLeod's Creek in 1901 when his brother Richard is listed on the Census as residing there with one other adult male.  They appear to have both been mining in the area according to both death certificates.

There is an ancestry public tree which links Emma Spruce nee Hyatt with Emma Maria Hyatt, and I did send this person a message in August asking if John Hyatt's marriage certificate confirmed his birthplace as Enfield, but, to date, even though the tree owner would appear to have been on the site regularly since then, no response has been received.

I know that Krui River and Murrindi aren't that far from Tamworth, and obviously the informant on her death certificate (her husband Herbert) may have got the information wrong.  However, I cannot find anything that places John and Emma Hyatt at any point in Tamworth.  Would it be reasonable for someone born in the Merriwa area to say they were born in Tamworth?

I don't need any other information on the Hyatts unless anyone can find what happened to John Hyatt junior or his mother Emma Birch as I've been researching the family extensively for many years.

Thanks

Nicola

[majm]

....An Emma Hyatt married Herbert Spruce at Raymond Terrace Weslyan in November 1887.  The entry contains no parent's details and as far as I can see, none of the witnesses are members of the Hyatt family. ....

There's many a rural NSW marriage registration held by NSW BDM that has elusive blanks.  Even NSW BDM admit on their website that there's details not on their registers.

Here's a thread I did up some time ago that may be useful, as the information was actually provided but simply not forwarded to the Sydney HQ of NSW BDM at the time, and NSW BDM has not ever finalised a full reconciliation of their records.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,546609.0.html

Cheers, JM.

[majm]

I have just checked,

The NSW Electoral Roll 1870 for the Electorate of THE UPPER HUNTER includes localities as under:
Blandford, Murrurundi, Harben Vale, Sandy Creek, Wallabadah, Scone, Tamworth, Merriwa Musclebrook, Denison Town, and many many more in various police districts .....

Cheers,  JM

[wivenhoe]

Can you give the names of the witnesses on the 1887 marriage certificate. Emma's  age on her death certificate would mean she is a minor in 1887.

I can see children born to Herbert SPRUCE and Emily / Emily M.

What children are born to your Emma HYATT and Herbert SPRUCE?

[sparrett]

I'm not sure what if any background you are seeking re Emma BIRCH who you say may be the mother of Emma HYATT.
I do note the mother placing the "contact me" advertisement in 1877 which you have mentioned, requested reply to Binalong PO.

Young William BIRCH of Binalong
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/18764962

Land transfer mentions Ann BIRCH of Binalong
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/104857054

Births to women named Ann BIRCH
1001/1849 V18491001 35   BIRCH Emma
Parents James & Ann    
 
1142/1847 V18471142 32A    BIRCH William
Parents James & Ann       

879/1854 V1854879 40 BURCHSarah
Parents James & Ann

11585/1859 BURCH Ann      
Parents James & Ann
PICTON

Sue

[~MERLIN~]

James BURCH m. Ann MALONEY 1843 St. Bede's, Roman Catholic, APPIN #V18431954 92

[judb]

Are you discounting this birth?

NSW 1869 #9634, registered at Cassilis
Emma M HYATT
Parents John, Emma

Death certificates often have incorrect information and it may be that Emma had a later connection with Tamworth, leading the informant to believe that Tamworth was her birthplace.
Cassilis is in the same general area as the Hunter Valley towns mentioned.  Certainly closer than the BIRCH/BURCH family in the Binalong/Picton areas.

Just a thought - Judith

[smudwhisk]

There's many a rural NSW marriage registration held by NSW BDM that has elusive blanks.  Even NSW BDM admit on their website that there's details not on their registers.

Here's a thread I did up some time ago that may be useful, as the information was actually provided but simply not forwarded to the Sydney HQ of NSW BDM at the time, and NSW BDM has not ever finalised a full reconciliation of their records.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,546609.0.html

Cheers, JM.

Thanks JM, I've had a look to see if the Raymond Terrace Wesleyan still exists but so far have been drawing a blank.  Unfortunately, being in the UK its a bit more difficult often to obtain such info but I'll see what I can find.

Re 1870 Electoral Register, interesting so they were all in the same Upper Hunter locality.  Thanks.

[smudwhisk]

Can you give the names of the witnesses on the 1887 marriage certificate. Emma's  age on her death certificate would mean she is a minor in 1887.

I can see children born to Herbert SPRUCE and Emily / Emily M.

What children are born to your Emma HYATT and Herbert SPRUCE?

The 1887 marriage witnesses look like Miriam Keasey and Annie Theasey but that's just what the handwriting looks like.

I've found details of Herbert and Emma's children and can cross reference them with the BMD index.  The problem I have is the identity of Emma as its the Hyatt family I'm following forward only thanks.

Added - Having had a dig about on ancestry, Miriam Keasey would appear to be Miriam Quainton wife of Frederick Keasey and Annie was their daughter who married Thomas Hutchinson in 1892.  Miriam and Frederick were both from Buckinghamshire and I can't see any connection with my Enfield Hyatt family so they were probably just friends of the family or friends of Herbert Spruce who I believe was from Newcastle upon Tyne.