Author Topic: Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire  (Read 856 times)

Offline Bigsul

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Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire
« on: Thursday 21 January 16 16:43 GMT (UK) »
Hello people,

My first post so bear with me please.

I've traced my line back to Richard Sulley (b.1794) and his wife Elizabeth Webster. I know his father was also Richard and his mother Elizabeth - possibly Hoyles, though as yet I can't link them with documentary sources. I've seen Richard 1794 Sulley spelled with and without the 'e'.
Before I go on researching does anyone know if these are alternative spellings of one name or two distinct family names?
There are a lot of both and my brain is beginning to hurt!
Many thanks,
Steve

Offline lizdb

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Re: Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 21 January 16 17:07 GMT (UK) »
When you get that far back, spelling tends to be fluid.  So you will probably see both spellings, and maybe others as well.   I wouldn't be looking for any strict ruling as to how "yours" is spelt, or wondering about if they are different families.

As time went on, people tended to settle with one particular spelling.

In my own family, way back there are Edmonds/Edmunds/Edmends/Edmens/ etc to name a few. No rhyme or reason, just random.
As time went on different lines tended to settle with a particular spelling. Mine were always Edmonds with an "o", and until I started research it would never have occurred to us that our ancestors would have spelt it in any other way - to us Edmunds was a completely different name!  Another line, we found, started using Edmends, and that became established right up to the present day.
But even in modern times, with established spelling, errors and misreasding occurs. My nephew married very much as an EdmOnds, but his marriage in the gro indexes is recorded as EdmUnds, so somewhere along the line it was misread.

I would be searching for sul*y if I were you, to cover Sully, Sulley, Suly.  Or even Sul* to include Sullie aswell!
Edmonds/Edmunds - mainly Sussex
DeBoo - London
Green - Suffolk
Parker - Sussex
Kemp - Essex
Farrington - Essex
Boniface - West Sussex

census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Annie65115

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Re: Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 21 January 16 21:30 GMT (UK) »
Baptisms, all at Notts St Peter, father Richard, a victualler,  and mother Elizabeth

1786 12 18      Mary   SULLEY   
1788 12 01      Thomas   SULLEY   
1790 08 22      Ann   SULLEY   
1792 04 15      Elizabeth   SULLY   
1794 11 12      Richard   SULLEY   

Marriage at Nott St Mary:
1784 12 21   Richard   SULLY   Elisabeth   HOYLES   

There is an earlier baptism for a Richard in Arnold so if you are sure of the Arnold connection, he may be yours:
1762 01 24      Richard   SULLY   father Thomas      mother Mary      

and that would fit with this burial at Notts St Mary )
1819 07 06   Richard   SULLEY   age 57   abode Parliament St, Nottingham St Mary   

As you say, the surname seems to have been concentrated in Arnold but I can only see Sulley and Sully on the Notts FHS CD.   
Bradbury (Sedgeley, Bilston, Warrington)
Cooper (Sedgeley, Bilston)
Kilner/Kilmer (Leic, Notts)
Greenfield (Liverpool)
Holyland (Anywhere and everywhere, also Holiland Holliland Hollyland)
Pryce/Price (Welshpool, Liverpool)
Rawson (Leicester)
Upton (Desford, Leics)
Partrick (Vera and George, Leicester)
Marshall (Westmorland, Cheshire/Leicester)

Offline Annie65115

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Re: Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 21 January 16 21:37 GMT (UK) »
Next generation which you may already have:

marriage at Notts St Mary
1826 07 19   Richard   SULLEY   Elizabeth   WEBSTER   

but also, I'm sorry to tell you, there's this couple who also married at Notts St Mary

1827 10 07   Richard   SULLEY   Elizabeth   DENMAN   

Between 1825 - 1841 there are no fewer than 20 baptisms which seem to be shared between these two couples and a possible third family with the same parental names in Calverton. Do you know what occupation your ancestor had? That will help to tease them out because it all looks rather muddled otherwise!
Bradbury (Sedgeley, Bilston, Warrington)
Cooper (Sedgeley, Bilston)
Kilner/Kilmer (Leic, Notts)
Greenfield (Liverpool)
Holyland (Anywhere and everywhere, also Holiland Holliland Hollyland)
Pryce/Price (Welshpool, Liverpool)
Rawson (Leicester)
Upton (Desford, Leics)
Partrick (Vera and George, Leicester)
Marshall (Westmorland, Cheshire/Leicester)


Offline Bigsul

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Re: Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire
« Reply #4 on: Friday 22 January 16 13:49 GMT (UK) »
Huge thanks to lizdb  for helping with the spelling query and Annie65115 for the added information. I can now re-instate the four generations back from Richard Sulley and Elizabeth Webster that I deleted some time ago over doubts about spelling and the pedigree connection between Richard and his parents. Fortunately I kept the research notes!
All this is now resolved because of your help.
My grandmother's maiden name was Catherine Webster Griffiths and Elizabeth Webster was her great grandmother. Webster appears as a middle name quite often in the intermediate generations for both male and females so the descent is positively confirmed.
Richard started as a lace cap maker but died at 86 as a provision dealer in Aston, Birmingham. Once again my profound thanks for your help.

Offline Annie65115

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Re: Sully/Sulley Arnold, Nottinghamshire
« Reply #5 on: Friday 22 January 16 14:29 GMT (UK) »
My pleasure  :)  It's what rootschat is for!!

Here are various baptisms for you in case you don't have them; all Notts St Mary, all parents Richard and Elizabeth. Comparing with the censuses there are still some missing but they don't seem to be on my disc.

1827 06 19      Samuel   SULLEY   father's occ Lace Maker   abode Parliament St   
1832 01 14      Richard   SULLEY                     Grocer                     Parliament St   
1833 05 13      Elizabeth Ann   SULLEY             Grocer                     Parliament St   
1835 12 14      John Webster   SULLEY             Lace Manufacturer     Mansfield Rd   

I can't see any other burials that might be relevant.

Do you want any more info re Arnold families in the 18th century?
   
Bradbury (Sedgeley, Bilston, Warrington)
Cooper (Sedgeley, Bilston)
Kilner/Kilmer (Leic, Notts)
Greenfield (Liverpool)
Holyland (Anywhere and everywhere, also Holiland Holliland Hollyland)
Pryce/Price (Welshpool, Liverpool)
Rawson (Leicester)
Upton (Desford, Leics)
Partrick (Vera and George, Leicester)
Marshall (Westmorland, Cheshire/Leicester)