S27900 marker

[winmeek]

Okay, I did figure out how to get the s27900 data off the site, are you a Williams?

[Llanfihangel]

No, It's Kit 180710

Cheers

Llanfi

[winmeek]

Thanks I see your info.  I have my ancestry traced back to a Thomas Meek born about 1735 in Ahoghill Parish, County Antrim.  My Meek line was planted in Northern Ireland.  The family lore appears to have more significance now.  The progenitor was supposedly the Thomas Meek who in 1688 commanded the ship "John Trelawny" in the battle of the Armada.  The John Trelawney was a coaster provided by several towns in Cornwall so presumably Thomas was also from that region.  He was a friend of Drake who was from Devonshire and is on the crew list for Drake's voyage that circumvented the globe. Thomas supposedly got a land grant in Ireland for military service.  The records however show that a John Meek was in the plantations in 1609.  Perhaps John was a son of Thomas and the progenitor of this Meek dna group?  There are 25 of us tested to Meek dna group E by y-STR.  I am planning to get another Meek SNP test, that will probably wait until I can get a discount.  I live about a mile from the FTDNA office.

[DewiSant55]

I come very late to this thread, having only just joined RootsChat. I'm pretty sure I've communicated by email with winmeek (or one of his relations), but not with the others on the thread. I am FTDNA kit 559793 and YSEQ kit 20882. On the Big Tree I am shown below SNP Y81518 but on FTDNA's Big Y block tree I am still below R-BY19604 because I tested for Y81518 on YSEQ to save having to pay for the BigY700 upgrade. It was winmeek or a relation who kindly alerted me to the fact that three close matches who had upgraded to BigY700 showed the Y81518 marker.

I'm afraid I have nothing to add to the thread itself - my experience of DNA is very limited - but I want to contact Llanfihangel as we are relatively close on the Big Tree and we both still live in the UK. My closest DNA matches (Williamson, Danse, Smith) are all US-based and as far as I know were unaware of their probable Welsh roots until they did the Big Y test. I cannot use the PM system until I have posted three times and I'm not sure if this counts as one or if I have to start a thread. One way or another, I'll be in touch with you, Llanfihangel, if I may. If any of the others have any helpful comments relating to my DNA tests do please say so.

[Llanfihangel]

Hello DewiSant55

I was born in Wales, and my family came from Breconshire. You joined the R-ZZ37 Project at FTDNA and have probably gone as far as you can with their BigY

I have been researching the Williams families in Breconshire for years now, looking for relatives of a "Deacon" William Williams who left Radnor/Breconshire for Ohio in 1820. I don't have any DNA data for him, as he never took a test. There is another Williams with a very close match to me (my kit is 180710) on the Project website. Although kit 828954's ancestor came from Breconshire in the early 1800's we have been unable to find any reasonable family link.

I think you might have a bit more success if you added your ancestor's birthplace and country " ... Wales) to your ID on FTDNA

I have been in touch with a couple of others from Wales who are on the same Project. However, you should bear in mind that you need a close Y-67 or greater match to have a reasonable chance of tracing ancestors because Welsh surnames are patrynomic before about 1700.

I have a relative William Thomas who had two sons .. one named Thomas William and the other William Thomas!!

I have had good success with FindmyPast in tracing my supposed ancestry back to 1714. It took a lot of time and lots of searches. However, the best trace I got was from Rootschat a long time ago.

Once you have identified a possible ancestor, you can look at FreeReg (on line) as well as on-line wills at the Library of Wales. The Library of Wales also has an online enquiry service, that is extremely helpful for focussed questions and searches of obscure Church records. They also have a Chat line, but I've not used it so far..

FTDNA hasn't turned up ANY close matches to my markers with my surname so far!

Cheers,
Llanfi

[DewiSant55]

Thank you, Llanfi.

I'm also in the Williams, Williamson, Welsh Patronymics and R P312/subclades projects. I've followed your suggestion about adding Wales to my Direct Paternal Ancestor - I had already given Wales as his country of origin, but that didn't appear on the FTDNA project charts. I hope this is what you mean - if not, please let me know.

I understand that the chances of YDNA helping to break down the wall at my paternal g-g-grandfather are slim, but at least I've found a few distant cousins in the US and who knows what the future will bring as others test positive for the S27900 marker?

[ThomasDNA]

Hi,

I am the volunteer administrator of the FTDNA Williamson Surname Project.  I have a cluster of S27900 descendants who come through Y81518:

S27900 > FGC39551 > FGC53441 > FGC39549 > FGC39559 > BY19604 > Y81518

The surnames that belong to this SNP include Williamson, Smith and Price.  Immediately upstream, we then have Williams, Lewis, Jenkins, and Evans at BY19604.  The group of 11 Big Y participants at BY19604 average only 5 mutations, which suggests that it is reasonably recent and perhaps within the timing of written records; STRs likewise seem to support this possibility.

Llanfihangel mentioned that patronymics were still common in Wales before 1700, meaning that a family line could have several generations of closely related individuals migrating off to the American Colonies through the late 1600s to early 1700s, but each then having a unique surname here in the States.  Have any of you looked at your early lines to identify surnames that branched off of them?

Llanfihangel, you seem to connect in with this group at FGC39559, which has some 21 participants with Big Y averaging only 8 mutations, so not too much further out.  Do you have a public tree of your pre-1800 ancestors that I could take a look at in considering this question?  I saw that one of the Williams lines within R-S27900, who is not too far removed from our Williamson group (Y111 GD6), taces his line to an "Ellis ap William ap Hugh, b. 1590 Merioneth Wales"; with that name itself allowing for lines of surname Williams, Lewis, and Pugh if any of those three generations were to leave patronymics in favor of a consistent surname (noting that Williams, Lewis and Pugh are all surname clusters within the R-FGC39559 branch).

Thomas

[Llanfihangel]

Hello ThomasDNA,
FTDNA Big Y 700 data shows that I match a Williams (Y111-1) and we are so close that FTDNA generated a new Haptotype family for the two of us called  R-BY67074 immediately under R-FGC39559.
Both of our families come from Breconshire, Wales. My Family stayed in Wales, and his family emigrated to Radnor Ohio. In spite of strenuous efforts, neither of us can find even the remotest family connection,
There was a spate of emigrants from Breconshire to Radnor Ohio, after a David Pugh (Skreen Farm, Llandeilo Graban)  purchased land there about 1803. As I posted before, David Pugh's father married Mary Williams in Llandefalle Breconshire in the mid 1700's. His eldest son David emigrated to Ohio, almost immediately after a "Deacon" William Williams (who was married to David Pugh's sister Isabella) had returned to Breconshire, after doing a scouting trip led by a Theophilus Rees from Pembrokeshire.
I failed to trace Deacon Williams birthplace in Wales, although I had lengthy correspondence with a descendant in Licking Ohio. Also I found no link at all between my family and David Pugh's.

Also, I have a fairly close Y111-7 with Ellis ap William ap Hugh 1590 Merionethshire, Wales. His lineage is truly outstanding, and Rea Williams (Duncan Williams' son) made a database of thousands of Williams's in North America and Wales. http://rea-williams.com/getperson.php?personID=I17739&tree=tree1
Rea traced his Merionethshire family back to the 1600s and the details have been confirmed by several notable geneaologists.
Once again, I found no connection between my family and his, but I expect there are many Williamsons in his database. Rea's haplotype is R-S27900, but he died a couple of years ago, and there is little prospect of going deeper into the haplotype comparisons.
There is a family tree on Ancestry that has an accurate view of my family. I didn't publish it, and it was developed independently but the details are quite accurate.
I have sent a personal message to you, and we can discuss off-line
Best Regards,
Llanfi