Painter Family

[ostrauts]

Hi,

I've researching the Painter family I descend from.  My 2x great grandmother, Isabella Emma Painter was born in Old Swinford, Worcestershire c: 1832 and she married John Sparry in 1855.  I've obtained their marriage certificate last week to discover her father was James Painter and they married in Saint Thomas, Dudley.  Her father is recorded as deceased on the marriage cert.

So, I've begun to find out more about the family and discovered a recorded for a Emma Painter who was christened on 5 Nov 1837 in Old Swinford to the parents James & Sarah Painter.  So, that might be her.  I've also located a possible match in the census records of 1841 for James Painter (b: 1797-1801) living on Green Lane, Old Swinford.

James is living with Sarah Nash and her children; James, Ann & Isabella (b: 1833).  I think its possibly the right family.  But its the Nash/Painter names that has thrown me and that if it is the right family then Isabella has recorded James as her father, when he might be her stepfather.

Anyone have any thoughts on this one?

Many thanks,
Stuart

[spendlove]

Hi,

Sarah Nash and James Painter were not married by 1841, I cannot find a marriage after this
date.

Have you found the family in the 1851 Census, if so is Sarah still living with James Painter is
her surname Painter?

Judging by the age differences of the children it would appear that James and Ann were
born Nash and possibly Isabella was the dau of James Painter.

Try and find the christening for James and Ann, you will then see if they are the children of
an unmarried Sarah Nash or the children of  a Mr. Nash and his wife Sarah.

Spendlove

[Annette7]

Whilst I've found out a bit it just continues to muddy the waters!

In 1841 the 3 Nash children - James, Ann and Isabella would appear to me to all have been born as Nash to a James and Sarah:

James Nash bp.2/7/1823 Stafford, Worcestershire son of James and Sarah
Ann Nash bp.18/10/1827 Ombersley, Worcestershire dau. of James and Sarah
Isabella Nash bp.22/11/1833 Bromsgrove, Worcestershire, dau. of James and Sarah.

Don't know the occupation of James Nash but clearly it moved the family around.

In 1841 Sarah and the children now in Old Swinford - Sarah is head of the household and living with them is James Painter 40   as you already know.

Bearing in mind the first child was born in Stafford, Worcs. this looks a likely marriage:

James Nash married Sarah Rennells 14/1/1822 Stafford, Worcs.

So what happened to James Nash senior - can't find a obvious death before 1841 but certainly he doesn't seem to be around and living with Sarah and the children is James Painter.

I can't say that the Emma Painter baptised 1837 is Isabella (Emma) being rebaptised to  James and Sarah Painter.  Definitely no marriage between James Painter and Sarah Nash.

You say that Isabella Emma was born in Old Swinford, but half of the census' I've found her on state Bromsgrove which ties in with the baptism of Isabella Nash.

Isabella may have had no memory of father James Nash and only remembered James Painter (who appears to have died I think in 1843).  It's a sticky one, isn't it?   

Two years after the death of James Painter Sarah Nash remarries:

John Round, widower married Sarah Nash, widow 2/11/1845 St. Thomas, Dudley.

According to census Sarah Round, formerly Nash, nee Rennells was born in Dudley, Worcs.   

My instinct here is that Isabella was really a Nash, not Painter, although perhaps her only father figure was James Painter (she'd only have been 10 when he died).

I haven't found her in 1851 so don't know if she was Nash then, or Painter.

Can't solve the dilemma of Nash/Painter but thought I'd show my findings.

Annette

[ostrauts]

Morning,

Thank you Spendlove & Annette for looking into this for me.

I've looked back on my the census returns I have and I see that as you mentioned Annette, Isabel is recorded as Bromsgrove for her birthplace.

As of this morning, here is what I've uncovered:

1861:
John & Emma Sparry, Chann Hill, Stourbridge

1871:
John & Emma Sparrow (incorrectly named), Emma's birthplace recorded as Old Swinford, Worcs.

1881:
John & Isabel Sparry, Back Lane

1891:
John & Emla Is Sparry, New Street

Looking into the Nash children, James Nash married Susannah Woolridge on 17 Oct 1847, St Thomas, Dudley and in 1851 they are recorded on Back Street, Stourbridge union.  Ann Nash appears in 1851 as a General Servant in Dodderhill to the Cope family.

But as for Isabel, as you mentioned, can't find a census return for 1851 for her under the name of Painter/Nash.  As for the baptism for Emma Painter, 1837 I think that might be a red herring in relation to this family.

Stuart