Author Topic: Is this legal latin and what is it?  (Read 844 times)

Offline Old Bristolian

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Is this legal latin and what is it?
« on: Sunday 29 May 16 21:12 BST (UK) »
I hope someone might help with the following extracts from an Indenture of 1703. The document is mainly clear and easy to read, but I am puzzled by this phase - I have attached two images, one showing the whole phrase preceded by "One ffine..." and the second shows the final part again with the words following"..... to be pursued.." Any suggestions welcome. The document involves two parties with one party covenanting to appear before the Court of Common Pleas and "acknowledge and levy to the said...... & their heirs One ffine...." I think this is a transfer of property (there is much property listed thereafter) and it is to be conveyed via a fine - I assume the main document will be at TNA in the Feet of Fines. Again, any suggestions on this welcome

Steve
Bumstead - London, Suffolk
Plant, Woolnough, Wase, Suffolk
Flexney, Godfrey, Burson, Hobby -  Oxfordshire
Street, Mitchell - Gloucestershire
Horwood, Heale Drew - Bristol
Gibbs, Gait, Noyes, Peters, Padfield, Board, York, Rogers, Horler, Heale, Emery, Clavey, Mogg, - Somerset
Fook, Snell - Devon
M(a)cDonald, Yuell, Gollan, McKenzie - Rosshire
McLennan, Mackintosh - Inverness
Williams, Jones - Angelsey & Caernarvon
Campbell, McMartin, McLellan, McKercher, Perthshire

Offline Old Bristolian

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Re: Is this legal latin and what is it?
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 29 May 16 21:13 BST (UK) »
Sorry, the first image didn't upload - here we go again

Bumstead - London, Suffolk
Plant, Woolnough, Wase, Suffolk
Flexney, Godfrey, Burson, Hobby -  Oxfordshire
Street, Mitchell - Gloucestershire
Horwood, Heale Drew - Bristol
Gibbs, Gait, Noyes, Peters, Padfield, Board, York, Rogers, Horler, Heale, Emery, Clavey, Mogg, - Somerset
Fook, Snell - Devon
M(a)cDonald, Yuell, Gollan, McKenzie - Rosshire
McLennan, Mackintosh - Inverness
Williams, Jones - Angelsey & Caernarvon
Campbell, McMartin, McLellan, McKercher, Perthshire

Offline Bookbox

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Re: Is this legal latin and what is it?
« Reply #2 on: Monday 30 May 16 01:10 BST (UK) »
According to N. W. Alcock’s Old Title Deeds (1986), this is a standard phrase in ‘law French’ - sur conizance de droit come ceo etc. – commonly found in the ‘action’ clause of a final concord. Alongside this document there would originally have been a separate deed of conveyance, known as a Deed to lead (or to declare) the uses of a fine.

If you want to investigate further, googling brings up a number of early 19th-century conveyancing handbooks that purport to explain the different types of fine where this phrase might occur.

Offline Old Bristolian

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Re: Is this legal latin and what is it?
« Reply #3 on: Monday 30 May 16 10:35 BST (UK) »
Thank you Bookbox. I can see now that it is French, but I wasn't aware that this was used in law terminology. I have been googling fines etc. and am pretty sure now that this is a companion as you say to a Deed to lead the uses of a fine. I assume the final accord will be found in TNA in the Feet of fines, although in latin this time,

Steve
Bumstead - London, Suffolk
Plant, Woolnough, Wase, Suffolk
Flexney, Godfrey, Burson, Hobby -  Oxfordshire
Street, Mitchell - Gloucestershire
Horwood, Heale Drew - Bristol
Gibbs, Gait, Noyes, Peters, Padfield, Board, York, Rogers, Horler, Heale, Emery, Clavey, Mogg, - Somerset
Fook, Snell - Devon
M(a)cDonald, Yuell, Gollan, McKenzie - Rosshire
McLennan, Mackintosh - Inverness
Williams, Jones - Angelsey & Caernarvon
Campbell, McMartin, McLellan, McKercher, Perthshire


Offline Bookbox

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Re: Is this legal latin and what is it?
« Reply #4 on: Monday 30 May 16 10:51 BST (UK) »
If the 'foot' was deposited, and if it still survives, it should be at TNA in class CP 25/2.
You can search here by name of county to identify the right piece(s) for the relevant date ...

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C5392

There is some indexing of feet of fines on the open shelves in the Map Room, but otherwise you would have to order up the box(es) and search manually. As you say, anything found will be in Latin.

Offline Old Bristolian

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Re: Is this legal latin and what is it?
« Reply #5 on: Monday 30 May 16 19:01 BST (UK) »
Thanks again, Bookbox, I will follow that up

Steve
Bumstead - London, Suffolk
Plant, Woolnough, Wase, Suffolk
Flexney, Godfrey, Burson, Hobby -  Oxfordshire
Street, Mitchell - Gloucestershire
Horwood, Heale Drew - Bristol
Gibbs, Gait, Noyes, Peters, Padfield, Board, York, Rogers, Horler, Heale, Emery, Clavey, Mogg, - Somerset
Fook, Snell - Devon
M(a)cDonald, Yuell, Gollan, McKenzie - Rosshire
McLennan, Mackintosh - Inverness
Williams, Jones - Angelsey & Caernarvon
Campbell, McMartin, McLellan, McKercher, Perthshire