First Steps Before 1837

[Newwriter]

Hi, I am going to try my first steps beyond the computer screen. I have some ancestors whose name, age and birthplace vary census by census. They are as follows

1841 - missing presumed in Belgium since daughter born there 1838
1851 William Humphries age 45 born Newtown Montgomeryshire
1851 Elizabeth Humphries age 37 born Newtown Montgomeryshire
1861 William Humphreys age 52 born Newtown Montgomeryshire
1861 Elizabeth Humphreys age 45 born Newtown Montgomeryshire
1871 William Humphreys age 61 born Llandusel (presumably Llandyssil?)
1871 Elizabeth Humphreys age 56 born Newport, Montgomeryshire
1881 Elizabeth Humphries (Widow) age 63 born Newtown Montgomeryshire

I am pretty sure that these are all the same people because they live at the same address for the last three censuses and children's name tie in with 1851 and 1861.

So, how to proceed? How do I go about finding birth dates with such varied information?

I have found that there was a marriage between a William Humphreys and Elizabeth Davies in Llanllwchaiarn (just outside Newtown) in 1837. I am intending to join Montgomeryshire GS so that I can look at their Parish Records. Will there be something in that record that confirms place of birth?

So, is there any way from this information that I can reliably take my search further back? Do I need to search for other things? I have never seen a death certificate, I have been operating with mostly free information until now, do they have any additional information (DOB?).

Any help would be very much appreciated.

[avm228]

I have found that there was a marriage between a William Humphreys and Elizabeth Davies in Llanllwchaiarn (just outside Newtown) in 1837. I am intending to join Montgomeryshire GS so that I can look at their Parish Records. Will there be something in that record that confirms place of birth?

No, there will be no indication of birthplace in any record of the marriage.  You should be able to see this record for yourself on Findmypast (in their Powys Marriages collection).

If they died in England & Wales their death certificates will not state birthdates or birthplaces (this information was not recorded for deaths before 1969).

[Pheno]

However, if the 1837 marriage was in or after September (when civil registration started) then you could obtain details of both their father's if you obtained the marriage certificate.  If in early part of 1837 then these details are not necessarily recorded in the parish register.

Alternatively a birth certificate for one of the children born after 1837 would confirm Elizabeth's maiden name which you could use as proof of finding the correct marriage entry.

Pheno

[jim1]

As AVM suggests it might be worth buying a few credits on FindMyPast.
There's no Baptism in Newtown but there is one a mile away at Kerry in 1808 which is right in the middle of his birthdates on the census.
As the marriage occurred prior to Civil Registration you will have to rely on other factors such as who the witnesses were in the hope that one was a sibling.
As has been suggested a birth cert. to confirm mother's maiden name is the first step.

[StevieSteve]

One other possibly useful resource are the wills on the National Library of Wales site. Images of the actual wills are free to look at.

[trish1120]

The 07 May 1837 Marriage is on FreeREG but no other details noted just their names.

Trish

[avm228]

The 07 May 1837 Marriage is on FreeREG but no other details noted just their names.

Trish

The marriage was actually on 11 May 1837 (after banns) so I wonder whether the FreeREG entry is either a banns date or a mistranscription: "seventh" for "eleventh"?

[Newwriter]

Wow! Thanks everyone. You are such a great crowd. Unfortunately I am off to Pembrokeshire for a long weekend early in the morning, to see the puffins :-), but I can't wait to have a look at what all of your suggestions produce on Monday.

Thanks again for taking the time to help.

Best Wishes Tony

[Newwriter]

Hi Folks,

For a variety of reasons I haven't had a chance to take this further forward (or should that be further back) yet but I am probably going to take your advice and get a subscription or PAYG credits at Find My Past.

Can anyone tell me how much information you get to see about a marriage or birth with Find My Past please? Do their records show father's name in the marriage information and do they show parents names (and mother's maiden name?) in birth or baptism records? Or are they just a guide to confirm which copy certificate you need to order to get the extra detail?

Thanks for your help so far.

Tony