How do I trace the parents of Alfred Edward Hall

[Millmoor]

This might be John Edward Hall in the 1881 census:

Address 25 Beverly Lane, Tynemouth (Cullercoats).

Edward Hall 40 Master provision merchant b Sunderland
Elizabeth M Hall 39 wife b Felling
John E Hall son 10 b Newcastle (the relationship column is hard to read but may say son and heir)
Lettie Hall d 9 b Newcastle
Elizabeth Hall d 7 b Newcastle
Annie P Hall d 4 b Newcastle
Campbell Hall son 3 b Newcastle
William P Hall son 1 b Newcastle
Robert R Hall son 4 Months b Tynemouth
Jane Campbell sister in law unm 30 b Newcastle
Francis Franks servant 12 nurse
Thomasin Hardy servant 13 gen domestic.

From this assume that Edward Hall married Elizabeth Campbell.

You would need to obtain the marriage cert for John Edward Hall and Mary L Howe to confirm father's name. Edward Hall appears to have died in 1908 and left a will (see probate calendar). If the correct family this might help to identify the whereabouts of John Edward at that time.

William

[Shiny1]

WOW! This is fantastic. Thank you all so much, I was hoping for places to try looking so this is way more than I expected to find.

I was in the local library at the weekend and have got a copy of Alfred's entry in the wedding register, I just haven't looked at it yet and to be honest hadn't realised it would have parents names on.

He married Georgina English on the 30th of September 1916. His address is given as 13 Huddlestone Street in Cullercoats and his father is listed as John Edward Hall (deceased) who was a commercial traveller.

So from that and the information you have all found I'm thinking his mother was Mary Lizzie Howe who was seduced by a runner / footballer while her husband was off on his commercial travels and became pregnant.

Her sister-in-law, Elizabeth Howe, wrote to him (maybe pretending to be her mother?) and he tried to blackmail them both, then faked his death running away to South Africa before eventually being caught and then dying from poisoning in 1929.

Mary died in early November 1896 from meningitis etc and then her husband, Alfred's father, died three years later in Tynemouth leaving him with his aunt and uncle.

Wow! and people ask why we do this family history research.

I know after this Alfred joined the army in 1914. He went into the Cheshire Regiment as RQMS and served with them until 1917 when he took a commission into the Lancashire Fusiliers. He stayed in until the end of the war when he left as a Captain.

I'm fairly sure the newspaper cutting I have at home shows him and his wife celebrating their golden anniversary so despite everything that happened to him as a child he turned out well.

Does that sound about right to you all?

Thanks again for the help,

Michael

[josey]

We've had fun with this one!!

Her sister-in-law, Elizabeth Howe, wrote to him (maybe pretending to be her mother?) and he tried to blackmail them both, then faked his death running away to South Africa before eventually being caught and then dying from poisoning in 1929.

Only this error: it was the 'seducer' who wrote to Elizabeth Howe, Mary's mother, blackmailing her. He had letters from Mary asking for him to procure some 'pills'.  Elizabeth took him to court.

How  nice to know that Alfred led a full life despite all. I wonder if he ever knew his mother's story himself?

[Rosinish]

I would also change the "Subject" heading to include his full name which will attract family connections.

Annie

Added, Forgot to say, brilliant work by all & a great thread.

[Millmoor]

I think it would be well worth reading the newspaper articles, Michael, if you have not already done so. It was a story which featured in papers all over the country with headlines like "Cullercoats Sensation".
For example the blackmail letter starts by saying "I have it in my power to remove Bet Seymour from Cullercoats".

Unless I have missed something I don't think a death for John Edward Hall has been established. I read the expression in the newspaper article that Mary Hall was "living apart from her husband" to mean that they were estranged but stand to be corrected on that one.

This has been a fascinating search (you could probably write a screenplay!) and I think shows Rootschat at its best with good teamwork. That was a great find in the newspaper archive, Josey.

William

[nestagj]

how can we find the articles please
looks fascinating reading
Thanks
N

[josey]

The newspapers are online at findmypast or http://www.britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk/ - which are both subscription or pay per view sites.

Josey

[josey]

Unless I have missed something I don't think a death for John Edward Hall has been established. I read the expression in the newspaper article that Mary Hall was "living apart from her husband" to mean that they were estranged but stand to be corrected on that one.

I agree that John Edward Hall was probably alive in 1896, William. He may have moved away or even gone abroad after the case, in which case it may be difficult to trace his death. If it was recorded as 'John Hall' it will be almost impossible. Alfred was obviously taken in by his mother's family but whether that was  because his father had died, we do not know. As you say, that 1908 will for Edward Hall would be worth consulting.

ADDED: Looking for a John Hall in the correct occupation I found
in 1901 RG13; Piece: 3989; Folio: 65; Page: 16 Lancaster
there is a John Hall manager in .... shop born Tynemouth
William C Pyne   20 licensed victualler
Sarah A Pyne   22
Fred Pyne   18
Gerty Pyne   10
Donald Pyne   19
John Hall   32 visitor single [but then he would say this wouldn't he?]

[Shiny1]

A John Edward Hall married a Mary Lizzie Howe in 1st quarter 1891. A John Edward Hall aged 45 died in Tynemouth district in 1900.

This was the entry I was taking his death from, how do I find the probate? Is that on ancestry as I can get onto that.

I haven't looked at the newspapers, I was on a monthly subscription to find my past which ran out a week ago. I was going to leave it a while before renewing it - not any more.

Thanks again everyone,

Michael