George Newns also known as George Rogers Newns

[Liz newns]

Hi All,
Looking for Martha Newns,
 George Newns, also goes by George Rogers Newns or George Rogers, her son.no father named.
George Born 1841/ 42 in Wrexham to a Martha Newns. Martha in Jan 1842 married Thomas Rogers, they had a son Samuel. Martha then disappears and Thomas marries Ellen.
Martha lists a Philip as her father, but I  can't make link.
George lists his father as Richard on his marriage certificate.
I  am thinking George was illegitimate maybe born in Wrexham workhouse, was Martha her official name,maybe not.
Anyone out there researching Newns or Rogers, from Wrexham and Shropshire areas

[lizdb]

When you say "no father named" I firstly assumed you must therefore have the birth cert. But if so, you would a) know if he was born in the workhouse or not, and b) know a date of birth rather than 1841/1842.   So where are you referring to when you say "no father named"? 

If Martha married in Jan 1842, then there wasn't a lot of 1842 before that for her to have had George in, so does that imply an 1841 birth?  Have you found the birth reg? (now assuming you haven't got the cert)

it looks very much as if he was illegitimate, but used his step fathers surname sometimes for ease.

[avm228]

It isn't clear from your post whether you have a birth certificate for George - you say on the one hand "no father named" - is this from a baptism or birth certificate? - and later on that "maybe" he was born in Wrexham workhouse and you don't appear to know the exact date.

I can't easily see a relevant birth registration, but if he was born in the workhouse you'd expect there to be one.  If you have such a certificate, please can you tell us all the details on it?

Cross-posted with lizdb with many of the same thoughts

[lizdb]

Also - where are Thomas, MArtha and George in 1851?  They are escaping me!

[avm228]

Thomas RODGERS is with new wife Ellen in Lancashire by 1851 (plus children George 9 and Samuel 7): HO107/2195/478/12

I see that the second son Samuel was registered Samuel ROGERS, Sep qtr 1843 Ellesmere with mmn NEW (according to the GRO online register).  Ellesmere is the correct district for his stated birthplace of Overton, Flintshire.

[avm228]

The 1861 census shows the couple in Chester as Thomas B Rogers and Ellen D Rogers (again with George and Samuel). RG 9/2629/30/6.

Marriage therefore likely to be:

Dec qtr 1850, Wirral

Thomas Becket Rogers
Ellen David Thompson

with the same reference, folio 19 page 392.

[lizdb]

Death  (possible)

Oct/Nov/Dec 1844
Wrexham
Ref 27 198
Martha Rogers age 40

[trish1120]

Just beat me lizdb

[trish1120]

Couple of possibles;

Martha NEWNS Christened 16 Sept 1804, Bangor Is-coed, Flint, Wales.
Parents ROGER/ELIZABETH

Martha NEWNES Christened 15 April 1804, St Peters, Liverpool, Lancashire
Father JOHN Newnes

That is if she was unmarried when she had George.

GRO Index Birth Reg;
NEWINS, -   (no christian name, no Mothers maiden name)
GRO Reference: 1841  S Quarter in WREXHAM  Volume 27  Page 262