Brick Wall - ancestor with common name and complex history

[lizzydarcy]

I am trying to locate the records, ideally an entry on the 1939 census via find my past, for a family member with a really common name. Despite her being deceased, I'll need to speak in general terms.

This ancestor adopted my late grandfather in the early 1930s and raised him alongside 3 other children (also with common names) who may or may not have been adopted too. At least one of the children had a different surname to her and my grandfather. From the oral history I have gathered, I understand that she was a widow and she died in the early 1950s. I have good reason to believe the husband either died before my grandfather's arrival or shortly afterward. I also have family photos of a number of events which support the history I've gathered and filled in some, but not many, gaps.

I have found several death records for the area where the family was based but none seem to match with the oral history and photos I have.

Beyond searching for a death record and the 1939 census, I have tried without success searching newspaper records hoping to find either:

• an obituary for her
• an obituary for her husband (or an article about his death as I've been told he died in unusual circumstances) so I can get his name
• the weddings of the children so I can possibly confirm the remain children's surnames

I suspect I need to complete the records of my grandfather's generation to break this wall but as the only concrete information I have about the 2 other children are their first names and that neither married, I am at a lost where to search. I am hoping this will generate some ideas.

[Girl Guide]

Do I take it that you have not found any of the family in the 1939 census?

Are you willing to give us the name of your grandfather and his date of birth so that we can at least start with one person?

Do you know when and where the lady died?  Have you checked to see if she left a will?

[KGarrad]

I presume you are referring to the 1939 National Register?
There was no census in 1939

It's not a census, because it was continually updated (by the NHS) until 1971.
And a census, by definition, is just a snapshot of a single night.

[garstonite]

quote " according to oral history "
EVERY family has members who tell little white lies to protect an older family member - don't always believe all what you are told - many times it is not true .

[aghadowey]

Welcome to Rootschat  Lots of clues to work from even if it later turns out that family stories aren't quite accurate.

This ancestor adopted my late grandfather in the early 1930s
If this was an official (rather than an informal arrangement) have you tried to find out is any records of this adoption might survive?

From the oral history I have gathered, I understand that she was a widow and she died in the early 1950s.
Since you know her name and probably an area have you tried looking for possible death in index?
https://www.freebmd.org.uk/search

If you think she might have left a Will or had an estate that needed administering check here-
https://www.gov.uk/search-will-probate

Newspaper notices can be tricky. Some families didn't bother much with notices (especially under difficult circumstances) and for the dates you probably need (c1930 onwards) many newspapers may not be online. Her husband's death, depending on the circumstances, may have been reported in the local paper (and picked up by others outside the area) if there was an inquest or court case involved. Have you tried search the above FreeBMD site to try and pin down a date for his death?

I can understand you are reluctant to post all the information you have so far but if you post here one more time (giving you a post count of 2) then you'll be able to use PM (Personal Message) system to get individual help privately if you wish.

[Girl Guide]

Aghadowey has given you some useful links from which you may be able to extract information.

It is indeed understandable that you may not wish to reveal all the information that you have at your disposal.  Much as we would like to help we are not able to until you provide some names.

Again as Aghadowey had said you are most welcome to send a personal message to one of us, or all of us, if you wish and we can then help you privately.  That way any information found will be for your eyes only and nothing will appear on this thread.

No doubt if you choose to send any of us a message we will say on here so that others know that investigations are being done off site.

The choice is yours.

[lizzydarcy]

I did not expect so many replies so quickly. Thank you all. Answers to some of the questions asked below.

Have you tried to find out is any records of this adoption might survive?
My grandfather was very through about keeping family records. I managed to research a number of lines on my grandmother's side due to it. I never found anything about the adoption or any of the rest of his side in his collection. It's possible one of the older children had them. For his birth certificate, his surname put was his middle name. For his marriage certificate, it was the adoptive mother. I have also searched on Find My Past to see if I can get find his or one of the other's adoption details.

have you tried looking for possible death in index?
Yes. Find My Past came up with several hints automatically but none fitted with the history I had. I then tried searches with a 5 and 10 year range search from the date of my grandfather's marriage and the two districts that fit where the family was.

Do I take it that you have not found any of the family in the 1939 census?
None of the children (though it could be that their records are closed.) There are a number of candidates with her name but I've nothing that narrows it down to her.

Have you checked to see if she left a will?
Not yet. I was not aware of the database that Aghadowey shared. Without a specific year of death to work with, it will take me sometime to check but I will.

I appreciate the support members can offer is limited due to no names but for now, I need to keep it that way. I know it makes it more difficult for both you and me.   

[Chilternbirder]

EVERY family has members who tell little white lies to protect an older family member - don't always believe all what you are told - many times it is not true

I had one piece of family oral history clearly incorrect according to the documents in my possession at the time but when Ancestry came along I found contradictory evidence that supported the story. I still have no idea which is true.

[JenB]

I know you've said that you aren't able to give a name, but you need to bear in mind that, in any event, we aren't allowed to do 1939 look-ups. We can only give information that can be gleaned from the free index.