Stoneavaich - Glenconlas as it was known

[Indiana.59]

You may rest assured that I will never attempt to help you again.

Quote from my previous thread . . .

"Which just goes to show how misinformed infomation has folk going down some strange roads, in the 1861 census John Shaw is born Tomintoul, Kirkmichael, in the 1881 census he is then born in Kirkmichael G, Banffs by the time he dies he is born in Kirkmichael, Perth and Kinross" . . .

It is xscot 1312 you should be helping here, not me, it is his quest, not mine . . . 

Bye Pet . . . 

[xscot1312]

Hi

Apologies for any confusion caused. And if my reply is now out of context as the original one I was typing vanished and I lost my train of thought. Any help and clarification is gratefully received as I have taken over this quest and have only been looking into it for a few months. I can confirm that I originally replied to a post placed by Indiana and it was kindly responded to. Duncan and Elspet are my family tree quests. If I come across information that differs from my relatives original research (started over 20 years ago) then I have noted this in my saved family tree. I can confirm that the image of Rev John Shaw is my relative - we have the original colour oil painting. b. 10 Apr. 1820 Banff, left home aged 13 to train at Blairs College, then to Paris and returned to Glasgow and was appointed priest at Rutherglen and was Canonised and d. 3 Nov. 1885, Rutherglen.  The information I have on Elspet Gordon (father John Gordon, mother Margaret Stuart) b. 18 Sep 1792  (maybe 1793 - 2 birth records filled 1 year apart) d. 4 Dec 1834 at childbirth (baby Elspet) in Stronavaich. She married Alexander on 7 April 1817.  As for Duncan - b. 21 Aug 1826 Gunner Royal Horse Artillery Discharged 1850 after amputation of right forearm. On census in 1851 aged 26.  Thanks to Indiana for further details on him which helped me find his service number - he only appeared on PRO and not on military searches. On the same census there are another 2 Duncan Shaw's listed in Edinburgh (father and son), however this rules out a headstone in Dalry Edinburgh as my relative (much to my disappointment - as I used to live opposite that cemetery many moons ago). Elspet (Jnr). became her brother Canon Shaw’s housekeeper, but no other information is known. I only know about 6 children so another child is interesting and will look further into this - thanks for that information, as I have said I am taking over from family members who are now unable to continue. And we did hold original family trees that were started over 100 years ago.  So I am looking for gaps and for documentation to pass onto my children so it is not lost.  Any information is most welcome. Thanks for all the help and time given.

[Indiana.59]

Hi Scot, glad to see you back, I had a birth for a Duncan Shaw B: 15/8/1926, F: Alexander Shaw M: Elspet Gordon, are these Duncan's one of the same as yours is up as B: 21/8/1826, is yours a birth or baptism which is usually held days apart, back to Elspet Shaw, there was a housekeeper to John Shaw in the1881 census, John was up as being 59, but; she was called Eliz Shaw, aged 44, are Eliz Shaw and Elspet Shaw one of the same, ages of are seldom correct on censuses, and if so are we then looking at Lanarkshire in our quest to find more information on Elspet Shaw, nothing was stated to her relationship to John Shaw, but; both were up as coming from the same place of birth, Kirkmichael, seeing the paper census itself may yield more info, as Elspet Shaw may have remained a spinster, if Eliz Shaw and Elspet Shaw are one of the same, but; as I am not buying any Scotlands People credits until after the New Year, you will have to  bear with me on that one unless you have already got it, let me know if you have, I am glad the picture of John Shaw fitted your profile, I saw Canon John Shaw had been previously buried in Rutherglen, but; his remains were re-interred in Dalbeth Cemetery on 1 July 1950, as found on *Find a Grave, flowers were left on the site by a A. Kelly on the 24th of March 2020 . . . !

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/201964302/john-shaw

Laters, Indiana . . . 

[Indiana.59]

Hi again xscot1312

I just wondered as to what may have happened to the smaller children in 1834 after Elspet's death, as I could not find any 1841 census for this family . . .

BIRTHS:

DONALD SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 2/6/1818 - TOMINTOUL 1841 23

JOHN - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 10/4/1820 - TOMINTOUL 1841 21

JANE - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 9/4/1822 - TOMINTOUL 1841 19

ALEX SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 1/11/1824 - TOMINTOUL 1841 17

DUNCAN SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 15/8/1826 - TOMINTOUL 1841 15

SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 6/7/1828 - TOMINTOUL 1841 13

SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 2/5/1830 - TOMINTOUL 1841 11

JAMES SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 26/10/1832 - TOMINTOUL 1841 9

ELSPET SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 4/12/1834 - TOMINTOUL 1841 7

We now know thanks to you that John Shaw set of on his Priesthood at the age of 13, but; what of the other children, as Alexander Shaw did not marry Isabella Munro until 1837 . . .

MARRIAGE: ALEXANDER SHAW/ISABELLA MUNRO - 3/12/1837 - KIRKMICHAEL

A copy of this marriage is needed as it quite clearly says - Kirkmichael, not Tomintoul - Kirkmichael, to see if any reference is made to who Isabella's Munro parents were, and a possible residence address . . .

Also, I wondered if this could be your Duncan Shaw in the 1841 census, he is a farm servant at Rynamarsh aged 14, residing with a Margaret Shaw, clip of the census shown below . . .

Indiana . . .

[Indiana.59]

To xscot1312

To where I referred to Duncan Shaw born 1826 was deceased came from the book, "The Genealogcal of the Highland familes of Shaw" by Alexander Mackintosh Shaw, Shaw of Tordarroch, printed 1877

"Quote"

Alister married first a daughter of Murray of Binzean, next, a daughter of John Shaw, Dalnivert; and had three sons, Duncan, William, and Donald, of whose issue (if any) nothing is known to the writer.

Farquhar, by a daughter of John Shaw, Glenclunie, Braemar, had three sons, Duncan, William, and Alexander. The eldest of these married a daughter of Alexander Shaw of Inchrory, and had two sons, James, who died without issue, and Alexander, who resided at Inchrory in Glenavon, and Stroneavaich in Glenconlas.

The latter was father of Donald, now at Minmore, Glenlivet; John, a Priest of the Roman Catholic Church, now at Rutherglen; Duncan, deceased; and Alexander, also deceased. Donald, the eldest of these, has three sons, John, Donald, and James

So; it is fair to say by the time this book was written and printed in 1877 your Duncan Shaw was deceased . . .

And, hence why I was chasing down the Braemar line of Shaws in the first place, as the only birth I can find that fitted my William Shaw born 1754, was a William Shaw born 19th of May, 1754 to a Duncan Shaw, and Janet Downy of Gleneye, Braemar, William's father was a Duncan Shaw baptized 23 February 1722 to a Donald Shaw of Glenluy, any further information on that would gratefully received . . .

And, also my sudden interest in the Alexander Shaw of Glenmullie, Tomintoul, in the 1841 census, born Aberdeenshire, Crathie . . .

"My family research files may be in a box, but; my luckily my memory isn't, quite yet . . . 

Indiana Shaw, still researching on Christmas day . . . 

[Inchrory]

I've just joined RootsChat as I think I can add some light to the Alexander Shaw m Elspet Gordon thread.
Alexander (sometimes recorded as John) married Elspet Gordon in 1817. The marriage entry (RC) says that he is the nephew of Donald Shaw, Laganale - that supports the idea that Alexander's mother is a daughter of Alexander Shaw of Inchrory and Elspet Farquharson.  However, the Janet Shaw born 1765 actually married John Gordon of Inchnacape.
There was, however, an earlier Janet born to Alexander Shaw and Elspet Farquharson in 1754 - now this is only a suggestion, I can't prove anything, but given the errors in recording accurate family names what about the first Janet was actually known as Elspet (after her mother) and it was she who married Duncan Shaw, son of Farquhar Shaw?  Elspet Shaw widow of the family of Inchrory died aged about 80 in 1834 - guess what year that makes her birth - yes, 1754!
Elspet Gordon (wife of Alex/John Shaw) died on 4 December 1834. Their youngest daughter Elspet was born and baptised on 4th December 1834, I can only assume that Elspet snr died in childbirth.
I am descended from Alexander Shaw and Elspet Farquharson's youngest son Donald.
Hope this helps to unravel some more of the story?
I have more info on the family if it's of any interest.

[xscot1312]

Thanks Inchrory. I have the marriage as 9 March 1791 but can't find any saved information on this in my personal files. The first Janet information makes sense as Janet no 2 was definitely recorded with a John Gordon. More information is most welcome as I am just trying to piece things together and check the information I received. I too am a descended from Alexander Shaw and Elspet Farquharson's youngest son Donald. :-)

[xscot1312]

Hi again xscot1312

I just wondered as to what may have happened to the smaller children in 1834 after Elspet's death, as I could not find any 1841 census for this family . . .

BIRTHS:

DONALD SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 2/6/1818 - TOMINTOUL 1841 23

JOHN - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 10/4/1820 - TOMINTOUL 1841 21

JANE - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 9/4/1822 - TOMINTOUL 1841 19

ALEX SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 1/11/1824 - TOMINTOUL 1841 17

DUNCAN SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 15/8/1826 - TOMINTOUL 1841 15

SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 6/7/1828 - TOMINTOUL 1841 13

SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 2/5/1830 - TOMINTOUL 1841 11

JAMES SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 26/10/1832 - TOMINTOUL 1841 9

ELSPET SHAW - ALEXANDER SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - 4/12/1834 - TOMINTOUL 1841 7

We now know thanks to you that John Shaw set of on his Priesthood at the age of 13, but; what of the other children, as Alexander Shaw did not marry Isabella Munro until 1837 . . .

MARRIAGE: ALEXANDER SHAW/ISABELLA MUNRO - 3/12/1837 - KIRKMICHAEL

A copy of this marriage is needed as it quite clearly says - Kirkmichael, not Tomintoul - Kirkmichael, to see if any reference is made to who Isabella's Munro parents were, and a possible residence address . . .

Also, I wondered if this could be your Duncan Shaw in the 1841 census, he is a farm servant at Rynamarsh aged 14, residing with a Margaret Shaw, clip of the census shown below . . .

Indiana . . .

I think I now have all the information on Duncan Shaw, thanks for this, and yes he did die at a young age.  For information Donald Shaw he went on to have 6 children and died in 1899; John Shaw death is know; Jane possibly emigrated (still to confirm possible death 1900) ; Alexander married and died in 1875;  Elspet still unknown. I have found one 1841 census for part of this family. Although personally I will look at information around Isabella once I have more information on immediate family members - as I don't think Alexander and Isabella had children between them.   Where was the information on the seventh unnamed child found? As I have no record of this child.

[Indiana.59]

Hi again xscot1312

Where was the information on the seventh unnamed child found? As I have no record of this child.

My mistake or maybe not: It was a John Shaw/Elspet Gordon, not Alexander Shaw, but; given they had children every couple of years, there would be a gap for 1830, so this child may well be one of theirs, it was found under the RC birth records . . .   

SHAW - JOHN SHAW/ELSPET GORDON - M - 2/5/1830 - 3/5/1830 - TOMINTOUL (SCOTLANDS PEOPLE)

To emphasize this I have put up James Shaws birth in 1832 as found on *Libindx

REF:                   NM149765
Surname:                SHAW
Forename(s):        JAMES
Date of Birth:        26 OCT 1832
Place of Birth:        KIRKMICHAEL
Father's Name:        JOHN SHAW STRONEVAICH
Mother's Name:      ELSPET GORDON

Hope this helps . . .

We are in deed from two seperate lines, but; still related via the Alistar Shaw of Inchrory

Indiana . . .