Author Topic: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?  (Read 1957 times)

Online brigidmac

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Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:08 GMT (UK) »
My grandmother s cousin firmly believes that they were related by marriage to queen victoria.s grandaughter Patricia
How we could prove or disprove

Princess Patricia  did marry a commoner Alexander Ramsey   in 1919 but he was a colonel and an honourable
She became lady Patricia Ramsey 
Apparently the couple met and spent time in Canada where he was aide de camp from 1911 - 1916 and had son Arthur

it seems unlikely he.d be connected to poor mining families in Scotland

Her father was Arthur Duke of Connaught
B. 1st may 1850 Arthur William Albert...?   Would he have a surname and be on censuses and other records  ?
He married priincess Louise in 1879.  She was daughter of Prince Frederick of Prussia

How do aristocrats get named on records ??
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Online brigidmac

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:13 GMT (UK) »
The couple were in South Africa in the 1920.'s according to this account I copied
 

Lunch at Clarence House, 3rd July 1922, account by William Howard Taft, former US President.

"The Duke [of Connaught] lives at Clarence House, a very pleasant home I should judge, and he had with him at the time his daughter Patricia and her husband Captain Ramsey, for she married a commoner, as well as his daughter-in-law, Princess Arthur of Connaught. Her husband, the Duke’s son, is the Governor General of South Africa, and she had just returned from there, leaving her husband on duty. Earl Balfour, Lord Desborough, the active men of the Pilgrims, Mr and Mrs Rudyard Kipling, Winston Churchill and his wife, and an aide who had accompanied Princess Arthur from South Africa were also there. The Earl of Cavan, who is now the Chief of Staff of the British Army, and possibly one or two others, whose names I have forgotten, were also members of the party."

So here is revised listing:

1 Princess Arthur of Connaught (formerly Princess Alexandra, Duchess of Fife)
2 Earl of Cavan, Field Marshal Frederick Lambart, Chief of Army Staff
3 Lady Patricia Ramsey (formerly Princess Patricia of Connaught, daughter of Duke)
4 Prince Arthur, Duke of Connaught and Strathearn, son of Victoria, masonic Grand Master
5 General Sir Horace Lockwood Smith-Dorrien, Governor of Gibraltar
6 Caroline Starr “Carrie” Kipling, wife of Rudyard (née Balestier)
7 Elsie Kipling, daughter of Carrie and Rudyard
8 Rudyard Kipling, poet, writer, advisor to the Imperial War Graves Commission, and founder member of masonic “Builders of the Silent Cities” lodge for IWGC staff.
9 Captain George Bambridge, diplomat. Marries Elsie Kipling in 1924.
12 Helen “Nellie” Taft, wife of William [13]
13 US Chief Justice and former US President William Howard Taft, wrote about this event.
14 Sir Reginald Theodore Blomfield, IWGC memorial architect (Menin Gate, Ypres)
15 Captain William Masters, R.A.S.C, in whose collection this photo was found.
16 Lt-Col Herbert “Tom” Goodland, Deputy Controller, Imperial War Graves Commission
17 Sir John Simon, Attorney General, later to become Home Secretary and Lord Chancellor
18 Sir John James Burnet, prominent Scots architect, IWCG commissions Gallipoli, Palestine
23 William Henry Grenfell, 1st Baron Desborough, athlete, public servant and politician
25 Possibly Winston Churchill, said to be present with wife Clementine [24] by Taft
27 Sir Robert Stodart Lorimer, Scots Arts & Crafts architect, IWCG Naval memorials
28 Sir James Allen, High Commissioner to New Zealand, connected with IWGC
29 Sir Frederic Kenyon, Director and Principal Librarian, British Museum, IWGC advisor
30 Waitress


This means her son also married a princess
Roberts,Fellman.Macdermid smith jones,Bloch,Irvine,Hallis Stevenson

Offline panda40

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:16 GMT (UK) »
You can find their marriage records and view them on the 1939 register as well.
Regards panda
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Offline sgf28

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:19 GMT (UK) »


Offline MaxD

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:25 GMT (UK) »
http://www.unofficialroyalty.com/march-17-daily-featured-royal-date/  His name was Ramsay and he was in the Royal Navy not the army.  Click on him and ferret around in his ancestry to see whether that gets anywhere near your known family.

MaxD
I am Zoe Northeast, granddaughter of Maximilian Double.
 
It is with great difficulty I share with you that in the early hours of 07 August 2021, Maximilian passed away unexpectedly but peacefully.

With deep sadness,
Zoe



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Offline sgf28

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:27 GMT (UK) »
Lady Patricia's husband was born Alexander Robert Maule Ramsay in London, England, the son of Sir John William Ramsay, 13th Earl of Dalhousie and Lady Ida Louise Bennet.

Not too common :)

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:29 GMT (UK) »
Thank you panda but would you look under their titles or do you need a surname ?

That's the question ?
Thanks for the article sgf28

I .ll send it to the grandaughter of the lady who told this story
And we.ll have to look into how our grandmothers grandmother Euphemia Ramsey b 1820 could possibly have been  related to the honourable Alexander
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Offline Pheno

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:31 GMT (UK) »
"The couple were in South Africa in the 1920.'s according to this account I copied
 

Lunch at Clarence House, 3rd July 1922, account by William Howard Taft, former US President.

"The Duke [of Connaught] lives at Clarence House, a very pleasant home I should judge, and he had with him at the time his daughter Patricia and her husband Captain Ramsey, for she married a commoner, as well as his daughter-in-law, Princess Arthur of Connaught. Her husband, the Duke’s son, is the Governor General of South Africa, and she had just returned from there, leaving her husband on duty. Earl Balfour, Lord Desborough, the active men of the Pilgrims, Mr and Mrs Rudyard Kipling, Winston Churchill and his wife, and an aide who had accompanied Princess Arthur from South Africa were also there. The Earl of Cavan, who is now the Chief of Staff of the British Army, and possibly one or two others, whose names I have forgotten, were also members of the party."


The way I read this it was his daughter in law Princess Arthur of Connaught, who was married to his son Prince Arthur who were in South Africa not his daughter Lady Patricia Ramsay.

Pheno
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Offline panda40

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Re: Princess married a commoner. Where on records ?
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 30 January 18 15:43 GMT (UK) »
Just put his name into freebmd no title and a date range between 1918 and 1920 the marriage will be shown. Same for 1939register I just put his name in and he can be easily identified.
Regards panda
Chapman. Kent/Liverpool 1900+
Linnett.Kent/liverpool 1900+
Button. Kent
Sawyer. Kent
Swain. Kent
Austin/en. Kent
Ellen. Kent
Harman. Kent/ norfolk