Missing GRO record

[khanman47]

Looking for advice. I am looking for a marriage certificate for Charles Thomas SIssons and Jane Elizabeth Able who married in Surrey in 1853. I have a record of Banns indicating that they married at St Mary, Lambeth, England around June 1853, (Marriage Banns Date:12 Jun 1853) but I cannot find any corresponding GRO record. Any reason why this would be, and what options can I pursue?
Thank You

[ShaunJ]

There is no evidence that the marriage took place, certainly no indication in the banns book.  Banns were read on 12th, 19th and 26th June; she was a spinster and a minor. His name is written as Sisson, not Sissons. There is no check mark against the entry to indicate a subsequent marriage.

[khanman47]

1871 Census shows them together with a swag of kids. Is it possible they never married?

[dawnsh]

Hi khanman47

Welcome to Rootschat 

Shaun beat me to it!

An online tree also suggests the marriage but maybe permssion wasn't given by her parents as she was a minor.

The birth of a child in 1855 suggests they didn't "have to" get married in 1853, maybe you need to look outside of England & Wales, eg Scotland, Channel Islands.

It is entirely possible the didn't marry or did marry but for wahtever reason, the entry hasn't made its way into the GRO index.

[Ladyhawk]

There is no evidence that the marriage took place, certainly no indication in the banns book.  Banns were read on 12th, 19th and 26th June; she was a spinster and a minor. His name is written as Sisson, not Sissons. There is no check mark against the entry to indicate a subsequent marriage.

Hello and welcome to Rootschat 

In the banns book the entry before Charles was James George Thorn
banns read and there’s NO mark (x) by their names either

The entry after Charles was James Sellar Turnbull banns read 1853
marriage date written  27th June Can view that marriage certificate

I checked the pages before and after his marriage on 27th June  NO marriage entry
found in the book for Charles Thomas Sisson or James George Thorn

[macwil]

Banns were usually valid for three months, if the marriage took place after that period new banns should have been read.
Did they wait until they were 'of full age' (I.e. 21) and they didn't require parental consent?
Have they been found in 1861 census?
We're they still in the same area in '61 & '71?

Occasionally copies of local Registrar Office records didn't get to the General Registrar's Office, clerical errors etc.
So I would look for the local Registrar's Office(s) of the place(s) where the banns were read, where their first child was registered and where they were when they turned 21. The marriage if one did take place would be entered there first and a copy sent to the GRO, occasionally this didn't happen, the clerk slipped up, lost his place, turned two pages etc. etc.

Be aware that there may be charges applied by the Registrar's Office, especially for extensive searches, which many will not undertake. Check their websites for advice and T&Cs. If there is no website listed check the county council one, they often include advice on BMD registrations.

Of course they may have gone out of the areas they were known in. I believe a certain town in Scotland was a favourite destination for such couples.

Have you checked the children's Birth registrations. If the couple were unmarried the children could only have been registered with the mother's Surname and the father's name could only appear on the certificate if he was present at the time of registration. Unless a few porkies were told!

[julianb]

One other point about Banns.  Banns may have been read in more than one parish.  So if one of the pair is shown as being of a different parish, the wedding may have taken place there.

JULIAN

[Ladyhawk]

Banns were usually valid for three months, if the marriage took place after that period new banns should have been read.

Did they wait until they were 'of full age' (I.e. 21) and they didn't require parental consent?

Have they been found in 1861 census?

We're they still in the same area in '61 & '71?

Have you checked the children's Birth registrations.

If the couple were unmarried the children could only have been registered with the mother's Surname and the father's name could only appear on the certificate if he was present at the time of registration. Unless a few porkies were told!

1861 Registration district:   Newington
Chas Sissons 26 Southwark Surrey   
Jane Sissons 27Southwark S? G?   
Chas Sissons 6 Surrey Lambeth   
John Sissons 3 Midx St Pancras   
Caroline Sissons 1 Lambeth Surrey

John SISSONS  mmn     ABEL     
1857  J Quarter in SAINT PANCRAS  Volume 01B  Page 74   

Caroline SISSONS   mmn  ABEL    
1859  D Quarter in LAMBETH  Volume 01D  Page 331   

1871 Registration district: St Saviour Southwark
East Street
Charles Sissons 36 Boot Maker
Jane Sissons 36
Charles Sissons 16
John Sissons 13
Caroline Sissons 11
Thomas Sissons 9
Ann Sissons 6
William Sissons 4
Loise Sissons 11 Months
all born Lambeth Surrey

Thomas SISSONS,    mmn    ABEL     
1861  D Quarter in NEWINGTON  Volume 01D  Page 176   

William SISSONS, mmn  ABLE     
1866  D Quarter in NEWINGTON  Volume 01D  Page 265

Lois Sissons mmn ABLE   
1870 Jun qtr. in St. Saviour   1d   155
 
Have not found Charles or Annie Sissons birth entry on GRO Indexes with mmn ABEL 

There is an 1864 birth entry Newington for an Annie Sissons  mmn BOND 

Charles Sissons appears to be their first child, he married 1877 as
Charles Thomas Sissons, East Street, father same name and his age on m/c 27 (born c1850), so he's gained a few years , 1861/71 census gives his yob c1855

his sister Annie married 1883 age 20 (born c1863) father CTS boot finisher

Have looked again but I can't find a marriage for Charles Thomas Sissons to Jane Elizabeth ABEL 

There is this record but doesn't give parent/s name, admitted by sister 25 Ch?ham St. 

It gives her religion as Rom. Cath., she was admitted from Newington Parish

 - if she's Charles & Jane's daughter could they have married in a Catholic church 

Lois Sissons
Admission Age:   7 (1870)
Admission Date:   13 Jun 1877
Borough:   Southwark
Parish or Poor Law Union:   Southwark
Place:   London, England
Title:   Saint George's Workhouse, Mint Street Register, 1876-1877

[khanman47]

I now have a birth record PDF from GRO for William which shows:
1866 Births - St Peters, Walworth, Surrey.
23rd December 1866, 19 Nelson Place, William, Boy, Father - Charles Sissons, Mother - Jane Sissons formerly Able, Father's Occupation - Journeyman Shoemaker, Signature, Description and Residence of Informant, X mark of Jane Sissons (mother), 19 Nelson Place, Walworth, Registered 31st December 1866.
Getting beyond Charles Sissons (father) seems to be the problem.