Author Topic: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.  (Read 1192 times)

Offline court389

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Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« on: Wednesday 07 February 18 18:29 GMT (UK) »
Trying to make sense of this 1841 Scotland census. To the best of my knowledge, my 4th gg Agnes Crawford married James Kilgour in 1834. They gave birth to my 3rd gg Agnes Kilgour and 2 other children between 1837 and 1843. Now this is where I get lost.

I found a 1851 Scotland census(transcription, not original doc) with the occupants as listed:
Samuel Nicol   30
Agnes Nicol   34
Bryce Nicol   1   (son)
Janet Kilgour   13 (stepdaughter)
Agnes Kilgour   11 (stepdaughter)
Jamesina A Kilgour   8 (stepdaughter)

So I went a decade back to try and find one with the two oldest children living with their father, and this is what I found in the 1841 Scotland census(transcription, not original doc):

James Kilgour   30
Agnes Kilgour   25
Jennet Kilgour   10 Mo
Margret Crawfert   25

My current theory, which totally could be wishful thinking, is that the ages/names have been mixed up in the transcription of the 1841 census. my 3rd gg Agnes Kilgour should be roughly 10mos, her older sister Janet would've been around 2.5 years, and my 4th gg Agnes Crawford and James Kilgour would've been 25 and 30. Even more convincing, is both the 1841 and 1851 census list George St, Ayrshire as their address. But without the original document, I'm unable to confirm where the name Margaret is coming from.. or if my theory is even remotely close.  ???

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Offline miw

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 07 February 18 18:50 GMT (UK) »
Could Margaret be Agnes's sister with Crawford having been mis-transcribed?

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Offline court389

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 07 February 18 19:11 GMT (UK) »
Very possible.. I'm trying to find some solid evidence to indicate who her parents were to see if she had some siblings. But there should be 2 Agnes' on the 1841 census as my 3rd gg Agnes was born in 1840..

I did find another 1841 census with an Agnes Crawford that was living/working at a hotel nearby in Ardrossan. Maybe its possible the Margaret in the 1841 census is a relative helping with the children?

Offline osprey

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 07 February 18 19:39 GMT (UK) »
have you found the death registration for Agnes senior on ScotlandsPeople? That should give names of her parents including mother's maiden name.
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline Mabel Bagshawe

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 07 February 18 20:34 GMT (UK) »
Suspect Margaret is related - this looks like her in 1851, also in George St

William Fergueson    35
Margaret Fergueson    34
William Fergueson    2
Matthew Crawford    4

Marriage was in 1848

Offline Millmoor

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 07 February 18 22:48 GMT (UK) »
Births in St Quivox

Parents James Kilgour and Agnes Crawford

Janet 16 July 1837
Agnes 3 July 1840
Jane 12 Aug 1842(is she Jaamesina in 1851?).

Parents David Nicol or Nichol and Agnes Crawford

Andrew 8 April 1849
Bryce 8 April 1849
Harvey 9 Nov 1857

1861 census has in St Quivox

Agnes Nicol wife 43

Jeremiah Gilgour daughter in law 18
Bryce Nicol son 11
Harvey Nicol  son 3

I think you need to seethe original to make sense of this but Gilgour seems rather close transcription wise to me and Jeremiah might be the transcription of Jamesina

1871 census

David Nicol 50 b Stirlingshire joiner
Agnes Nicol 52
Harvey Nicol 13

Cannot help but wonder if David is the Samuel from the 1851 census transcription.

If the correct family Harvey became a Church of Scotland Minister and you should find Agnes's death in the parish of Parton, Kirkcudbrightshire  in 1895. This would hopefully give her parents names.

(There is an entry for Harvey in the  Fasti ecclesiae scoticanae: the succession of ministers in the Church of Scotland  which name his parents as David Nichol and Agnes Crawford. He and his parents would appear to be buriefd in Parton Churchyard although to add to the fun and games name wise his mother has been transcribed in the MI as Ruth!).

William
Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)

Offline Millmoor

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 07 February 18 23:07 GMT (UK) »
Think that the Jeremiah Gilgour I quoted in the 1861 census may actually be Jemima (Jemima like Jamesina is a feminine form of James).

There is a death for Jemima Kilgour in Ayr in 1861 age 19, mother's maiden name Crawford. Her death cert. might provide an answer.

William
Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)

Offline osprey

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 08 February 18 10:00 GMT (UK) »
the death reg in Parton for Agnes gives her parents as Bryce Crawford, master mariner, and Anne Crawford ms Leggat. Agnes died 3 Nov 1895, age given as 80.

There is a marriage in St Quivox 28 April 1811 for Bryce Crawford but to Martha Legget

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTN9-WJZ
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline Millmoor

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Re: Hoping someone can help me make sense of this.
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 08 February 18 11:06 GMT (UK) »
Does the cert. name her husband(s), Osprey?

The Bryce Crawford connection would certainly help to explain Bryce Nicol's first name. ( I also think the first name Harvey could be explained by this birth in Gargunnock, Stirlingshire, 9 July 1820- David Nicol  with parents Andrew Nicol and Janet Harvie).

Court 389, did your Agnes Kilgour marry John McFarlane in 1860? If so I note that among their children are Jemima and Bryce McFarlane. Coincidence?

Re Bryce Nicol  it would appear that he married a Maria Kilgour. Maria was born in Gloucestershire but her parents James Kilgour and Elizabeth Woodward were born in St Quivox, James being the son of John Kilgour who farmed at Notmyre. Again coincidence?

William

Dent (Haltwhistle and Sacriston), Bell and Jetson (Haltwhistle), Postle, Ward, Longstaff, Purvis, Manners, Parnaby and Hardy (Co. Durham), Kennedy and McRobert (Banffshire), Reid(Bathgate), Watson (Wemyss), Graham (Libberton), Sandilands (Carmichael), Munro (Dingwall)