Author Topic: Grove Family from Wales.  (Read 440 times)

Offline tawe

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Grove Family from Wales.
« on: Friday 30 March 18 22:48 BST (UK) »
Long shot but I had family that left Wales & ended up in Illinois. My Gr Gr Grandparents Samuel & Mary Grove I have found then in Chicago. My Gr Grandfather went over as well but returned to Wales his Sisters Mary & Mary Jane I have found them & both married out in the US also his brother William Grove. I have found a William Groue in the 1910 census East St Louis Ward 2, Saint Clair, Illinois & again in the 1930 census down as William Groves East St Louis, St. Clair, Illinois & that's it with William on the census it has him as widowed but I can not find a record of a marriage or any other census I did find a death in 1933 E St Louis, St Clair, Illinois. Any help would be appreciated.
My problem is William.....
thank you in advance.
Tawe.
Flynn . Morgan .  Pugh . Sales. Davies.
Grove . Rees. Morriston Swansea

Offline AMBLY

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Re: Grove Family from Wales.
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 31 March 18 00:38 BST (UK) »
Hi Tawe,

I'm just noting the details you refer to, for easy reference:

1910 CENSUS:
Head: William GROUE 47,  widower,  b Wales, Imm 1883, Na. Stationery Engineer,
918 Piggott,  East St Louis Ward 2, Saint Clair, Illinois

1930 CENSUS:
Roomer: William GROVES 70, widower, b Wales, Imm 1877, Na. Station Engineer,
448 Tenth,  East St Louis, St. Clair, Illinois

1933 DEATH:
William GROVE, died 5 Jan 1933, age 74. Stationery Engineer
Buried: Canteen Twp, St Clair, Illinois

A few questions....

When & where in Wales was your William born - the man in the two census gives differing ages.  If you have his exact date of birth, and his mother Mary's 's maiden name all the better. Is her maiden name JONES? Was his birth registered Neath Mar Qtr 1959? 

Do you already have your William on a Passenger list to the US with other family - did they all go over together? The man in the Census gives differing  years of immigration. I think I can see your William in 1861 and 1871 Census in  Llangynwyd, Glamorgan, Wales - but not 1881.

Do you know where your William was in 1881?

(Noting: your William is not to be confused with William GROVE born 1860 registered Neath, mms RODERICK whose parents were William and Mary, had a brother named Thomas. Possibly a related family - lived also in  Llangynwyd in 1861. Both those brothers in the drapery trade - they immigrated to the US too in 1885 on the ship Samaria. That William is in Brooklyn in 1900 and 1920)

Cheers
AMBLY
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline tawe

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Re: Grove Family from Wales.
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 31 March 18 00:56 BST (UK) »
Yes you are correct you have the same information as I do Williams Mother was Mary Jones.

The William Grove with mms  Roderick is indeed related ( not the one I am looking for) Cant find William or his Father on passenger list. The three Mary's I found came over together 1890. My GrGrandfather Samuel I found two passenger lists for him but still unsure that either one is his? the only Census that I have been able to find with my GrGrandfather Samuel was in the 1900 census. the rest 1871,1881,1891 & 1911 Wales Census.

1881 census they are Name
William Grove
Age
29
Estimated Birth Year
abt 1852
Relation
 (Son)
Gender
Male
Where born
Maesteg, Glamorgan, Wales
Civil parish
Clase
County/Island
Glamorgan
Country
Wales
Street Address
Midland Terr
Occupation
Enginer (Driver)
Registration district
Swansea
Sub registration district
Llangyfelach
ED, institution, or vessel
7
family members with him
Samuel Grove
49
Mary Grove
46
Sarah J. Grove
20
Gwenllian Grove
18
Catherine Grove
16
Margaret Grove
14
Samuel Grove
11
Mary Grove
8
Elizabeth Grove
5
Mary O. Grove

William Grove
29
Flynn . Morgan .  Pugh . Sales. Davies.
Grove . Rees. Morriston Swansea


Offline AMBLY

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Re: Grove Family from Wales.
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 31 March 18 01:30 BST (UK) »
Hi Tawe

Ha  ;D Well, I didn't see that 1881 for looking, did I!  There they are, now in Swansea. Thanks for that.

So, your William is age 29, and Engineer, and presumably unmarried in 1881 (the enumerator didn't write a marital status unless it was 'married')

BTW:  Mary Jane - (enumerated as Mary O. age 4 mths on the 1881) I'd lay bets she is a grand-daughter of Samuel and Mary by one of the older daughters, not a second living daughter named Mary. If you check the GRO Birth index for what appears to be Mary Jane, registered Swansea Mar Qtr 1881, no mother's maiden name is listed. That lack of mms is indicating she is illegitimate and mother's maiden name is the same, ie: GROVE.

Do you have the family in 1861 (I have seen it, but you didn't mention it?)

Cheers
AMBLY
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline tawe

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Re: Grove Family from Wales.
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 31 March 18 05:42 BST (UK) »
I just looked at the GRO now & you are right no Mother's Maiden name & her date of birth is 12 December 1880 & on the GRO she was registered in the 1st quarter 1881 so definitely her!!! 

I did always wonder when she applied for a passport she put down that she was going to visit her Mother in Wales. ( I thought maybe Mary the Mother had gone back at sometime & then came back to the US)
Yes I have 1871,1861,1851 & 1841.

Tawe.
Flynn . Morgan .  Pugh . Sales. Davies.
Grove . Rees. Morriston Swansea