John Duffy, born Roscommon, Ireland 1861

[Real Lee History]

Mary Frances would be born before the second marriage.

Looks like John Edward 1893 and Mary Francis 1897 were before marriage of John/Elizabeth 1898 ??

[heywood]

I thought John Edward might have been born to Mary Hawthorn but now I can’t see a birth anyway 
Have you found his birth?

[Real Lee History]

I thought John Edward might have been born to Mary Hawthorn but now I can’t see a birth anyway 
Have you found his birth?

Potentially he may be a rouge ?
I have not found him through GRO at all and nor Mary Francis. I have located Henry (as you say - showing HOLYOAK as mmn)

Citation for Edward Birth: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XW1Z-8KG 

and whilst I don't have birth details for Mary (known as Fanny) I do have Census 1911 citation with both (all three) showing in above link ^

[heywood]

Another oddity with this baptism

https://www.familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/NNTG-JMR

John Edward baptised 9th August 1893 but your Joseph was born February 1893 

[Real Lee History]

Another oddity with this baptism

https://www.familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/NNTG-JMR

John Edward baptised 9th August 1893 but your Joseph was born February 1893 

Perhaps he should be un-linked. I know one thing for sure in the facts its my granddads birthday as we have his birth certificate and my Dad's/Mums existing knowledge..

However, my Grandad was born to Mary Hawthorn (mmn) and if John Edward born to Hassal (mmn) then could be same year. I have John Edward DOB 24 Jan 1893 and christening 9th Aug same year. ??

I realise this isn't your challenge but am certainly grateful for your time spent today

[heywood]

Oh we enjoy it and I am very much aware that I have concentrated on Manchester and not Roscommon.
I think to progress, you need to get the marriage certificates initially.
To some extent the other children are not as important at the moment.
With John’s father’s name you might be able to prove or find the Loughglynn records.

The original parish records for the marriages may have a note - sometimes the priest would annotate the record showing baptism details - I have seen it the other way where the baptism record shows the later marriage details.

[Real Lee History]

Oh we enjoy it and I am very much aware that I have concentrated on Manchester and not Roscommon.
I think to progress, you need to get the marriage certificates initially.
To some extent the other children are not as important at the moment.
With John’s father’s name you might be able to prove or find the Loughglynn records.

The original parish records for the marriages may have a note - sometimes the priest would annotate the record showing baptism details - I have seen it the other way where the baptism record shows the later marriage details.

Well I have had ' the bug' for a while and only now - with more time - am I pulling it together. I find days fly by and I haven't moved from searching and I get excited over the smallest of 'moves' forward with the tree. I can see the addiction

I will do as you say and work out how to order, through GRO, the Marriage Certificate of John and Mary initially as the first one and see what we get.

I will update as I gain further, until I nail this part of my tree

[heywood]

Yes thanks. I look forward to seeing what you find.

[hallmark]

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