Johanna Revels of Waterford

[alexreg]

Hi all,

I am trying to figure out what seems like some conflicting information regarding the birth of Johanna Revels in Waterford (city). She died in Chicago on 22 Nov 1930, and this death certificate details Richard Revells as her father and Johanna Powers as her moth, both of Waterford, Ireland. The age given on this certificate suggests she was born abt. 1870, as do a few other records (US census, immigration), though a few suggest earlier.

Now, the interesting thing is that there is no Johanna Revels born in Waterford, or indeed anywhere in Ireland, in that timeframe or to those parents. (I have used Ancestry.com to search the Irish baptismal records.) On the other hand, there is a Johanna Reville (Reville and Revels are well-known variants of the same surname), born Oct 1863 in Ballybricken, to a Thomas Reville and Maria McConnel – illegitimate. Now here's what curious: there's a Thomas Reville born Apr 1844 to Richard Reville & his wife Johanna in Ballybricken, Waterford. There's also a Margaret Reville born Oct 1853 to Richard Reville and Johanna Power (surname given this time!), and a Maria Anna Revelle born May 1859 to Richard Reville and Johanna Power (surname again given). All in the parish of Ballybricken.

So, I am very tempted to conclude from the above that in fact Johanna Revels was in fact born in 1863, not to Richard and Johanna Powers, but in fact to Thomas and Maria McConnel, where Richard and Johanna Powers were her *grandparents*. Perhaps because the birth was illegitimate, and not exceedingly long after Maria Anna's birth, she was raised as Richard and Johanna's child? Indeed, Thomas would only have been 19 at the time, and unmarried, so not exactly in a good position to raise a child. Perhaps Johanna (Revels) knew that Thomas was her father, but chose to list her grandparents anyway?

I'd be interested in people's thoughts on the above.

[Elwyn Soutter]

It’s not unusual for information on death certificates to be wrong as the information is simply the informant’s best guess. The informant may not have known Johanna’s parents and got some of that information wrong. Likewise ages are also frequently out by a few years. Do you have Johanna’s marriage certificate? If so, what parents did she put on that? It’s first hand information and so likely to be more reliable, (unless she had some reason for changing it). Was she naturalised in the US? If so, what parents names are recorded there?

[alexreg]

It’s not unusual for information on death certificates to be wrong as the information is simply the informant’s best guess. The informant may not have known Johanna’s parents and got some of that information wrong. Likewise ages are also frequently out by a few years. Do you have Johanna’s marriage certificate? If so, what parents did she put on that? It’s first hand information and so likely to be more reliable, (unless she had some reason for changing it). Was she naturalised in the US? If so, what parents names are recorded there?

The informant probably would have been one of her children, I'm guessing, who would never have met her parents, given they were separated by the Atlantic Ocean.

I don't believe there was ever a marriage certificate for Johanna and her husband – only a simple marriage record – but I'm trying to confirm that now. I'm probably going to have to work without it.

She claimed she was naturalised in 1900 on the 1920 census record, as did her husband John William Depear (he also claimed he was already naturalised on the 1900 record), but since there are no records of this, I'm not sure what to think. (I've searched both https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1838804 and http://www.cookcountyclerkofcourt.org/NR/default.aspx, to no avail. I'm pretty sure they would have been living in Chicago at the time of naturalisation. They don't show up on nationwide indices either.)

[annclare]

Tree on ancestry has a marriage record report for John William Depear and Johanna Revels in 1893 in Colorado. Do you have this?

[alexreg]

Tree on ancestry has a marriage record report for John William Depear and Johanna Revels in 1893 in Colorado. Do you have this?

Yep, I have the marriage record report. I've actually contacted the state archives for Colorado now, and expect to receive a full marriage certificate by email within the next few days. They told me they have one for this marriage, which is good news!

[alexreg]

Okay, I finally received the full marriage certificate. Sadly, no new information at all about their origins. What now, I wonder?

[alexreg]

Okay, for now I'm going with the theory that Johanna was the illegitimate daughter of Thomas Reville, where Thomas' parents were Richard Reville and Johanna Powers. Can anyone help me decipher this part of the birth record entry?



It's the entry beginning "Thomas & Maria", of course. I'm also interested in the names of the godparents/witnesses. Thanks!

[alexreg]

Okay, for now I'm going with the theory that Johanna was the illegitimate daughter of Thomas Reville, where Thomas' parents were Richard Reville and Johanna Powers. Can anyone help me decipher this part of the birth record entry?



It's the entry beginning "Thomas & Maria", of course. I'm also interested in the names of the godparents/witnesses. (You might have to scroll the image right to see them.) Thanks!

[alexreg]

As soon as I've said that, I may have to take it back... I've gone over the three US census records, a death record, and two immigration records for Johanna, and they all point to birth years from abt. 1868 to abt. 1871, with 1870 seeming like the most likely. These are far too late for the Oct 1863 of Thomas' illegitimate daughter. It may just be that her birth record was lost, I guess.

That said... a gap of almost 26 years between the birth of the first child (Thomas) and the last child (Johanna) seems rather large. Not impossible, but large.