Author Topic: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?  (Read 2127 times)

Offline okkool

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John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« on: Monday 25 June 18 00:26 BST (UK) »
I found a clipping from 1844 recognizing the 22 years of service of James Davis submitted by James Browne Evans Esq of Dean.  The 1841 census mentions a Joseph and Robert Davis (brothers?) but no James.

I have a 1841 census of John Davis a blacksmith in Kingham. This John was an assisted immigrant to Australia in 1845. I hope to find the baptism of John and it is quite possible that he is of the James mentioned in article and born in Spelsbury parish or as far west as Wychwood.
Thanks for any help Okkool
People will not look forward to posterity, who never look backward to their ancestors. Edmund Burke 1729-1797

Offline majm

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #1 on: Monday 25 June 18 01:02 BST (UK) »
hi,   :)

on your other current thread re your John DAVIS, his father is noted as James DAVIS a widower and the scribe did not record details for John's mum.  I suspect John's mum and her family (her Dad and/or her brothers) may have been deceased or at least their SURNAME was not known to John for many years, for him, as an adult, to not know either his mum's given or nee name when asked by that clerk, especially as John was able to provide his own baptismal records to that clerk (see Debra's post re the info recorded on the page that followed the one you uploaded).

 http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=795576.0

From John's New South Wales death cert (or official transcription) and/or his marriage cert (or official transcription) or on birth certs for his children ...  the church registers often have far more detail than NSW BDM summary registrations .... what information is given about John's origins ... NSW BDM civil registration commenced in 1856.  Those clues should be very useful to the regular RChatters on this Oxfordshire Look Up board.   :)  :) 
Online free to search NSW assisted passage ... per Elizabeth (3) 1845, unmarried Males start at page 9, alpha by surname.
https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/collections-and-research/guides-and-indexes/assisted-immigrants-digital-shipping-lists

NSW BDM 
http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/Pages/family-history/registry-records.aspx  SCROLL down to the heading re information available since 1856  :) and then scroll down further to information available prior to 1856  :)

So, as I understand it, from the 1845 disposal certificate documentation on your other current thread,  your John Davis' dad was alive at that time.  Here on this new thread I think you are asking about that Dad ... perhaps as you cannot find any supporting 1841 census entry for that ...  - James DAVIS was listed on that 1845 document as a Shiphand ... so possibly he was not enumerated on the 1841 census as perhaps he was at sea.

I should also note that John DAVIS was recorded as age 27 on that March 1845 record... so perhaps several years older than a lad born in 1820.  :D

JM  :)




 
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Offline majm

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #2 on: Monday 25 June 18 01:10 BST (UK) »
You need to have a look at the back of the form for more information.

John's baptism was certified by the Rev. Charles BARTER who was the rector at Sarsden for many years.  John's employer before he emigrated was James Haughton LANGSTON.  You can read about Charles BARTER and the Haughton LANGSTONs here:

http://www.parksandgardens.org/places-and-people/site/2910/history

As far as I can see the baptisms for Sarsden are only available from the Oxfordshire FHS.

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Sarsden_with_Churchill,_Oxfordshire_Genealogy

You are very lucky to have a full set of immigration records, including his disposal certificate - most have not survived.

Debra  :)

This is the info that should be very useful to follow up.  There's further posts on that thread with reference to where to find the parish registers etc ...  :)

Anyway, Debra noticed that the disposal documentation showed that John had obtained a certified copy of his baptismal record and she gave the name of the clergy certifying that he had checked the records, and she has provided further details about that clergyman.   

There's even the details for John's past employers ...

JM
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Offline okkool

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #3 on: Monday 25 June 18 02:56 BST (UK) »
Thanks for your insight JM.

Info from his immigration record:

  • He was born 1818
    His father was named James, occupation possibly shiphand and a widower
    He was a Blacksmith
    He was baptized re: Rev C Barter od Sarsden
    He was born in Oxfordshire _exact place name is speculation
    He worked for J H Langston of Sarsden
    His character was certified by 3 Ag Labs, 2 who appear on 1841 census of Kingham, Churchill parish
1841 census
  • Living in Kingham as blacksmith
    born 1821 although census is +- 3 yrs
    born in Oxfordshire

I will ask if my kin if they have obtained the marriage certificate and death certificate.  The death index record lists John Benjamin Davis having parents James MA Davis and mother Hannah. Maybe the actual certificate can add something. Marriage records before 1856 don't list parents, so that is a longshot.

I will see if any crew lists from around 1841 have possible James Davis listed.

regards Okkool
People will not look forward to posterity, who never look backward to their ancestors. Edmund Burke 1729-1797

Offline majm

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #4 on: Monday 25 June 18 04:18 BST (UK) »
  • He was born 1818
    His father was named James, occupation possibly shiphand and a widower
    He was a Blacksmith
    He was baptized re: Rev C Barter od Sarsden
    He was born in Oxfordshire _exact place name is speculation
    He worked for J H Langston of Sarsden
Rev C BARTER of Sarsden ... and worked for J H Langston of Sarsden  Debra gave you the given name for him ...  Rev Charles BARTER was C of E, so it is a matter of seeking a look up for the C of E registers of baptisms for Sarsden. 

https://historicengland.org.uk/listing/the-list/list-entry/1300861 Rectory, now house and flats. 1818 by G.S. Repton for James Haughton Langston of Sarsden House (q.v.) for the use of his brother-in-law, Reverend Charles Barter, rector of Churchill-cum-Sarsden.

and
http://theclergydatabase.org.uk/ (he is listed, and was at Sarsden from 1817 to 1830  :) )

J.H. LANGSTON of Sarsden ... as in Member of Parliament ... Debra gave you his given names too.   http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1820-1832/member/langston-james-1797-1863 


On NSW BDM marriage records for pre 1856, you may well find the names of the fathers of both bride and groom, but not always.   If C of E, you may well find the church holdings include the clergy's 'cheat sheet' for family groups ... See the NSW Resources board at RChat, as it includes live links to digitised images of various parish registers for the period from 1829 until well into 20th century for the C of E registers held by Christ Church Cathedral, Newcastle NSW ... excellent for sorting out what would be recorded in any particular year for C of E ceremonies.  :)

[/list]

JM
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Offline majm

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #5 on: Monday 25 June 18 07:01 BST (UK) »
I have looked for your chap in Kingham.  I can find a John DAVIS, aged 70, a Farmer, with others but not of that surname.   I had taken a snip of the image, to share here, seeking confirmation it reads 70.   
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7Q6-ZF8

Agh, I see that I am unable to attach a snip, to these county boards but the marks in column showing start and finish household  - is this as John 70, a Farmer; William 50; Mary 45; Elizabeth 30 etc …   

JM

I found a clipping from 1844 recognizing the 22 years of service of James Davis submitted by James Browne Evans Esq of Dean.  The 1841 census mentions a Joseph and Robert Davis (brothers?) but no James.

I have a 1841 census of John Davis a blacksmith in Kingham. This John was an assisted immigrant to Australia in 1845. I hope to find the baptism of John and it is quite possible that he is of the James mentioned in article and born in Spelsbury parish or as far west as Wychwood.
Thanks for any help Okkool
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline majm

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #6 on: Monday 25 June 18 08:15 BST (UK) »
Agh, Straight St, Churchill

John DAVIS, 20, Blacksmith, Yes (of the County).
HO 107/878/7

Last entry before Duckend…

 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7Q6-4V6

Some thoughts ...

 :) So how is this blacksmith confirmed as the chap who came to Australia per Elizabeth in 1845 ....
 :) is there a family connection between this blacksmith and the other members of that household ...
 :) there's several miles between Kingham and Churchill ... and in the 1841 census, they are enumerated as though they are separate districts.   

JM



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Offline okkool

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 26 June 18 01:24 BST (UK) »
JM
The 1841 Kingham census also contains the names of 2 of 3 signatories also in Kingham to the character of John Davis on 1945 Australian immigration. Too coincidental to be anyone else. Cannot find this John Davis on 1851 census.
okkool

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Offline majm

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Re: John Davis born abt 1820 son of James Davis Spelsbury parish?
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 26 June 18 01:35 BST (UK) »
JM
The 1841 Kingham census also contains the names of 2 of 3 signatories also in Kingham to the character of John Davis on 1945 Australian immigration. Too coincidental to be anyone else. Cannot find this John Davis on 1851 census.
okkool

I cannot find him at Kingham in 1841.  Can you please give the HO reference no for that OR the family search link.  Thanks,

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.