Author Topic: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen  (Read 1490 times)

Offline Glynm

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Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« on: Tuesday 31 July 18 21:07 BST (UK) »
Hi
If anyone has the Welsh version of Y Gestiana, the 1892 book about the history of the Porthmadog area, would you please check the attached page from the English translation version for accuracy. The section concerning the family of the famous harpist Dafydd y Garreg Wen is totally at odds with the family tree [8] in T Ceiri Griffith's Achau.
In Achau Humphrey Owen's daughter Ann Humphreys married John Griffith not Dafydd Owen.
Also in Achau the Dafydd who married Elizabeth Roberts, Ty Mawr Treflys was the son of Owen Owens who in turn was the son of Owen Humphrey son of Humphrey Owen.
I am interested in the accuracy since I have lines through both my Nains which converge with Humphrey Owen, or at least I thought they did until I saw this biography.

Glyn
Jones - Penmachno/Blaenau Ffestiniog/Capel Garmon
Thomas - Abererch/Porthmadog
Evans - Llangelynin/Llanaelhaern
Jones - Pwllheli/Abererch
Brammer - Lincolnshire/Nottinghamshire
Robb - London/Scotland

Offline pinot

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 01 August 18 00:50 BST (UK) »
My copy of the Welsh Gestiana is away on loan; I shall reply when i get to see it soon.

Offline Glynm

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 01 August 18 10:26 BST (UK) »
Thank you Pinot, I look forward to hearing from you.

Glyn
Jones - Penmachno/Blaenau Ffestiniog/Capel Garmon
Thomas - Abererch/Porthmadog
Evans - Llangelynin/Llanaelhaern
Jones - Pwllheli/Abererch
Brammer - Lincolnshire/Nottinghamshire
Robb - London/Scotland

Offline EmyrBorth

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 01 August 18 12:23 BST (UK) »
Hi
After  '...a shopkeeper at Garn;'  there's about 3 lines left out :
Elizabeth; Margery, wife of John H Williams, Foundry, Porthmadog; Janet, mother of Owen Roberts, singer (or musician), Talsarnau, and a daughter of theirs was the second wife of Griffith Humphrey, Tailor, Porthmadoc, father of Dr. Humphreys, Trawsfynydd.

Below is how it reads in the 1975 reprint of Y Gestiana (1892) . Perhaps someone better at deciphering/translating can check it out and you can check whether with the extra info it agrees with 'Ceiri'.

; Elizabeth; Margery, gwraig John H. Williams, Foundry, Porthmadog; Janet, mam Owen Roberts, Cerddor, Talsarnau, a merch iddynt oedd ail wraig Griffith Humphrey, Tailor, Porthmadoc, tad Dr. Humphreys, Trawsfynydd.

Too busy at the moment to have a proper look and compare with 'Ceiri'.
Emyr
 


Offline Glynm

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 01 August 18 14:50 BST (UK) »
Nice to hear from you again Emyr. Thank you for the missing three lines although it was the first paragraph that concerned me. My maternal Grandmother's line, according to Achau, is from Ann Humphrey to Jane Jones to Ann and Owen Ellis, Cefnymeusydd Isaf and my paternal Grandmother's line from Owen Humphrey to Owen Owens to Dafydd Owen, Cefnymeusydd Uchaf.
Looking at the page again I now see there is a glaring contradiction, unless I am missing something. At the bottom of the first column we have "Humphrey Owen's daughter Anne Humphrey married Owen Dafydd..." while at the bottom column  we have "Anne Humphreys daughter of Humphrey Owen (1693) was married to John Griffiths of Tuhwnt i'r bwlch" which agrees with Achau.
I think I can safely take Achau's version as being correct.

Glyn
 
Jones - Penmachno/Blaenau Ffestiniog/Capel Garmon
Thomas - Abererch/Porthmadog
Evans - Llangelynin/Llanaelhaern
Jones - Pwllheli/Abererch
Brammer - Lincolnshire/Nottinghamshire
Robb - London/Scotland

Offline pinot

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 01 August 18 23:58 BST (UK) »
Glad to see that Emyr has got to his Welsh Gestiana before me and that you have found out the contradiction. Not that it makes any difference to your research, I think the Robert Owen in the English Gestiana might have been surprised to find his occupation as ship-builder (saer llongau) being translated as ship's carpenter.

Offline EmyrBorth

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 14 August 18 11:42 BST (UK) »
Hi
The wording in the 1975 edition agrees with that in the 1892 edition.
Emyr

Offline Glynm

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Re: Y Gestiana - Descendents of Humphrey Owen, Garreg Wen
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 14 August 18 13:33 BST (UK) »
Thank you Emyr for going to so much trouble to check the the original 1892 edition. It appears that the trouble is with the English version  which would seems to have some quirky translations.

Glyn
Jones - Penmachno/Blaenau Ffestiniog/Capel Garmon
Thomas - Abererch/Porthmadog
Evans - Llangelynin/Llanaelhaern
Jones - Pwllheli/Abererch
Brammer - Lincolnshire/Nottinghamshire
Robb - London/Scotland