Author Topic: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell  (Read 3065 times)

Offline harfielc

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Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« on: Thursday 09 August 18 16:26 BST (UK) »
Hi there,

I have hit a brick wall.

Mark Molloy b. Dublin according to census 1825
Margaret Kell b Tipperary according to census 1830

I can work all evidence back to these 2 via the census, BC and D certificates of kids.

I am looking to get on with the irish links, but have hit a brick wall. 

Any help looking for marriage evidence in Ireland or Lancashire would be great as well as how to find records of them coming to England.

Thanks

Caroline

Offline hallmark

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 09 August 18 16:41 BST (UK) »
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0281  Tipperary PARISH

Other Parishes via Map.
Give a man a record and you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to research, and you feed him for a lifetime.

Offline harfielc

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 09 August 18 16:50 BST (UK) »
HI

Oh My.....thank you for this link.  I've never heard of this source.

But wow - how hard is it to read?

Is there anywhere on Rootchat where there are people with experience at reading this source?

Many thanks

C

Offline hallmark

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 09 August 18 17:23 BST (UK) »
HI

Oh My.....thank you for this link.  I've never heard of this source.

But wow - how hard is it to read?

Is there anywhere on Rootchat where there are people with experience at reading this source?

Many thanks

C

They aren't too bad...you just need to look for the name Kell, you don't need to read every word!
Give a man a record and you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to research, and you feed him for a lifetime.


Offline harfielc

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 09 August 18 17:29 BST (UK) »
Great. Txs.

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 09 August 18 23:34 BST (UK) »
Hi there,

I have hit a brick wall.

Mark Molloy b. Dublin according to census 1825
Margaret Kell b Tipperary according to census 1830

I can work all evidence back to these 2 via the census, BC and D certificates of kids.

I am looking to get on with the irish links, but have hit a brick wall. 

Any help looking for marriage evidence in Ireland or Lancashire would be great as well as how to find records of them coming to England.

Thanks

Caroline

If those children were all theirs they seemed to have moved about a fair bit. Were their reasons for potential moves? E.g. what was his occupation? Did they have relatives in the other places?

You're not likely to find records of them travelling from Ireland to England. Both countries were part of the UK. Going from Ireland to England was the same as going from Scotland to England. Only exception might be if they were beggars or vagrants and were picked up by authorities under vagrancy laws. There are Vagrant Passes in Lancashire Archives up to around early 1830s (Poor Law amendment Act 1834). These Passes are for people travelling through Lancashire on way to Liverpool to return to Ireland. There are none for journeys from Ireland.

Cowban

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #6 on: Friday 10 August 18 00:26 BST (UK) »
Look for a marriage on:
 Lancashire BMD
www.lancashirebmd.org.uk
You can also search index for the children's birth registrations on Lancs.BMD. Unfortunately mother's maiden names haven't yet been added to index of this or GRO for a lot of Manchester births. Lancs. BMD shows sub district, so more local than GRO Index.
 
Lancashire Online Parish Clerks
 www.lan-opc.org.uk
This is in 2 parts  - lists of churches in each area with transcribed registers for some churches, mostly C. of E., with some R.C. and Non-Conformist; and Ancestor Search section. Search options in Ancestor Search are individual church, place or whole county.

Lancs. BMD and LAN OPC are both volunteer-run sites. They are constantly being added to, so if you don't find something at 1st go, look again in a few weeeks, months, years.


As the people you're researching were in Manchester have you looked at Manchester & Lancashire Family History Society? The Irish group isn't operational at present. The website has a list of churches with dates of registers and locations of microfilm and transcriptions. It also has a list of cemeteries. A  M&LFHS  project is a searchable index by name of Catholic church registers in Manchester. I don't know churches or years covered or if it's finished. Website has guides to Manchester FH research.
 www.mlfhs.org.uk

GEN UKI has information about places including lists of churches with dates and maps. If you know where a person was living at a certain time do a distance search for churches of the relevant religion in the area, check if a church existed at the time, find it on the accompanying map and make a shortlist of churches they may have been baptised or married at. Church info includes whether it has/had a graveyard and when. Google GEN UKI then look up a place. It's another volunteer site. Some places have better coverage than others.

If your ancestors were Catholic take a look at Catholic Family History Society. Catholic FH research in England has particular difficulties. There are some informative articles on this website. Catholic burials in 19thC Manchester for instance.
Edit. I missed off the word "registers" from "A  M&LFHS project is a searchable index by name of Catholic church ..." You can enter a surname (+1st name + date if known).


Cowban

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #7 on: Friday 10 August 18 00:58 BST (UK) »
HI

Oh My.....thank you for this link.  I've never heard of this source.

But wow - how hard is it to read?

Is there anywhere on Rootchat where there are people with experience at reading this source?

Many thanks

C

If you come across any bits you can't make out or don't understand you can post a snippet in the deciphering handwriting section.  A tip is to try to read a few pages of the register before and after the entry which interests you. That way you will become familiar with the form of entries, priest's handwriting & abbreviations and with the families in the parish; you'll see that the same forenames & surnames crop up frequently. Some Irish Catholic registers are in Latin so you may need help with translation. Some of us do that here too.

There are plenty of pitfalls in Irish research. If you're new to it I advise you to read an introduction to it or you'll be stumbling around in the dark and risk wandering off down the first path you spot.
Try:
 National Library of Ireland
www.nli.ie/enfamily-history-introduction.aspx

Irish Genealogy Toolkit
 https://www.irish-genealogy-toolkit.com

There's plenty more advice & info online, including name variations, parish & townlands etc.

I would also advise that you firm up the family structure in England first. Be confident that you have all the children. Naming often followed a traditional pattern. Any long unexplained gaps between births? Find out what you can about the parents when they were in England. Study census. Not just the nuclear family but visitors, lodgers & neighbours. Did the parents have any siblings in England? Any other potential relatives about? Were any more specific about place of origin?
Cowban

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Hit a Brick Wall - Irish link - Molloy and Kell
« Reply #8 on: Friday 10 August 18 01:08 BST (UK) »
Why does Frances Kelly b. Whitehaven 1865 have a different surname?
Btw re death of Charles Molloy 1905.  Prestwich was a registration district which included some areas in Manchester. Districts changed boundaries several times between 1837 and end of 20thC.
Cowban