Bartholomew family Sevenoaks area puzzlement

[woodydog]

Hello everyone I've got a bit of a puzzle and I wondered if anyone could help..
I have a David James Bartholomew born 8th June 1878- 1939 reg (Sevenoaks on WW1 service records) married to Mary Elizabeth Payne (born 5th December 1877 Sevenoaks on 1939 reg) on 20th Aug 1899. In 1939 they are living in Brasted Chart. Children listed on Davids service record are James William 1915,Elizabeth Hilda 1909, George Frederick 1902, Elsie Ada 1912 and Ernest Alfred 1906. Now I think I have them on the 1911 census at Ide Hill BUT David James is listed as James Bartholomew, Mary as Elizabeth, George and Ernest with their given first names and Elizabeth Hilda as just Hilda;) In 1901 I think they might be doing the same trick with their names and at Ide HIll. Here's where the puzzle comes in- I can find the marriage reg of David James and Mary Elizabeth AND the death reg for David J BUT I can't find a birth reg in that name anywhere around the right date. I can find a reg for a James David Bartholomew in 3Q 1878 Sevenoaks. I've known folk to swap their first names for second but never on official registers.. what do you think?? I've tried tracking David Bartholomew backwards on the census with no luck. James Bartholomew I've possibly found on the 1891 and 1881 with a potential Uncle George Bateman born 1805 (1881 census) but 1826 (1891 census).... My head is boggled!! Can anyone else come up with any bright ideas?? In an ideal world I'd find out who the parents are of David James /James David Bartholomew.. HHHhheeeeeeellllppppp;) Any guidance would be very much appreciated.. xx
   

[rosie99]

Sorry, just making it a bit easier to read

Hello everyone I've got a bit of a puzzle and I wondered if anyone could help..

I have a David James Bartholomew born 8th June 1878 (Sevenoaks on WW1 service records) married to Mary Elizabeth Payne (born 5th December 1877 Sevenoaks on 1891 census) on 20th Aug 1899. In 1939 they are living in Brasted Chart.

Children listed on Davids service record are James William 1915,Elizabeth Hilda 1909, George Frederick 1902, Elsie Ada 1912 and Ernest Alfred 1906.

Now I think I have them on the 1911 census at Ide Hill BUT David James is listed as James Bartholomew, Mary as Elizabeth, George and Ernest with their given first names and Elizabeth Hilda as just Hilda;)   In 1901 I think they might be doing the same trick with their names and at Ide HIll.

Here's where the puzzle comes in- I can find the marriage reg of David James and Mary Elizabeth AND the death reg for David J BUT I can't find a birth reg in that name anywhere around the right date. I can find a reg for a James David Bartholomew in 3Q 1878 Sevenoaks.

I've known folk to swap their first names for second but never on official registers.. what do you think?? I've tried tracking David Bartholomew backwards on the census with no luck. James Bartholomew I've possibly found on the 1891 and 1881 with a potential Uncle George Bateman born 1805 (1881 census) but 1826 (1891 census).... My head is boggled!!

Can anyone else come up with any bright ideas?? In an ideal world I'd find out who the parents are of David James /James David Bartholomew.. HHHhheeeeeeellllppppp;) Any guidance would be very much appreciated.. xx
 

[rosie99]

Do you have the marriage certificate which should give fathers name 

[woodydog]

No sorry I haven't got any certs and can't afford to get any..  Thank you as well Rosie for making it a little less of a jubble jubble to read 

[rosie99]

Is this the family you are looking at in 1911 

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWDL-NS9

James Bartholomew      32   Westerham, Kent
Elizabeth Bartholomew   33   Sevenoaks, Kent
Katherine Bartholomew   Dtr 14 London Hackney, London
John Bartholomew   Son   11   Ide Hill Sevenoaks
George Bartholomew   Son   8   Ide Hill Sevenoaks
Earnest Bartholomew   Son   5   Ide Hill Sevenoaks
Hilda Bartholomew   Dtr   2   Ide Hill Sevenoaks

and in 1901
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9F2-426

James Bartholemew   22   Sundridge, Kent
Elizabeth Bartholemew 23   Sevenoaks, Kent
Elsie Payne Dtr   4   Hackney, London
John Bartholemew Son 1   Sundridge, Kent
Gertrude Payne   Sister 21   Sevenoaks, Kent

[woodydog]

Those are the ones but I'm not positive that they are right... but the kids fit on the 1991 census..

[rosie99]

I think they look promising 

I also think your George Bateman link is probably correct
1881 Sundridge
George Bateman Widower 76 bn Westerham, Kent
Ann Bartholomew   Lodger Married   30   bn Westerham, Kent,
William Bateman Nephew   8 bn    Westerham, Kent
James Bartholomew   Nephew   3 bn Westerham, Kent

Just off to see what else I can find

[rosie99]

Births Sep qtr 1878 
Bartholomew    James David   - Mothers maiden surname BATEMAN
Sevenoaks    2a   582

[woodydog]

That's the one I was betting on as well but if I remember rightly I couldn't find a Bateman/Bartholomew marriage and couldn't get any further back than the 1881 census... mind you my head had completely gone doolally by that point..