Author Topic: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds  (Read 3863 times)

Offline smithkei

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Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« on: Sunday 02 September 18 15:38 BST (UK) »
Hope someone can help. Ive built a fairly solid tree but am struggling with one of my Great Grandmothers and her father and beyond.
My Grandmother was Nellie Havenhand born 4/12 1889 Ecclesall Bierlow Sheffield. I believe her mother was Annie Elizabeth Holmes, born Liverpool about 1865/6, daughter of James Holmes of Alfred St Wavertree in the 1871 census. Annie Elizabeth married William Henry Havenhand in 1888 Sheffield.
First problem is I cannot find a birth for Annie Elizabeth Holmes who acc to census was born in Liverpool.

Secondly, acc to 1871 census her fatherJames Holmes was born Ecclesfield Sheffield, but in the 1881 census, which appears to be the same family, its Manchester(I think incorrectly transcribed as nr Chester). There is a James Holmes in the 1841 census for Ecclesfield with the right age, father Joseph. However, James remarried a Jane Wood Dalmer in Leeds 10/11/1879 and there his father is John.

Some help would be much appreciated!

Online rosie99

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 02 September 18 15:42 BST (UK) »
The GRO index shows no mothers maiden surname for Nellies birth registration which would normally indicate that she was illegitimate
HAVENHAND, NELLIE       -     
1889  March Quarter in SHEFFIELD  Volume 09C  Page 534


I now notice you have her date of birth as December 1889

HAVENHAND, NELLIE       Mothers maiden surname HOLMES     
GRO Reference: 1890  March Quarter in ECCLESALL BIERLOW  Volume 09C  Page 372   
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline candrjm

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 02 September 18 15:55 BST (UK) »
Birth:

HAVENHAND, NELLIE        mother's maiden name HOLMES        
GRO Reference: 1890  M Quarter in ECCLESALL BIERLOW  Volume 09C

Sorry Rosie you must have been editing while I was posting

Offline smithkei

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 02 September 18 16:00 BST (UK) »
4/12 89 is from the 1939 register After she married  to Albert Smith. Itís registered in Q1 1890 Ecclesall Bierlow 9c 372


Online rosie99

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 02 September 18 16:08 BST (UK) »
Sorry candrjm I was amending my post

Can you please post the 1881 census for Nellies mother
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Offline smithkei

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 02 September 18 16:12 BST (UK) »
I really do appreciate your responses but Nellie Havenhand whereabouts were well established. Itís her mother Annie Elizabeth Holmes and her father that are the mystery.

Offline smithkei

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 02 September 18 16:29 BST (UK) »
Sorry candrjm I was amending my post

Can you please post the 1881 census for Nellies mother

Cant post the file size. James Holmes born Lancashire Manchester, Mason, 68 Ecclesall Rd Sheffield, aged 48, wife Jane born Leeds aged 50, Kate E Barnes(nee Holmes ) born Sheffield 24. Jessie born Sheffield 18, Annie E born Liverpool aged 14, James born Liverpool aged 11.

Offline candrjm

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 02 September 18 17:00 BST (UK) »
Birth:

HOLMES, ANN  ELIZABETH      mother's maiden name BURNS      
GRO Reference: 1866  J Quarter in WEST DERBY AND TOXTETH PARK  Volume 08B  Page 303

Link to 1871 census:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VBFK-7TT

Birth for Jessie J Homles shown in the census:

HOLMES, JESSIE  JANE      mother's maiden names BURNS        
GRO Reference: 1862  S Quarter in ECCLESALL BIERLOW  Volume 09C  Page 231

Edit added:

Marriage:     Dec 1854   
Burns    Elizabeth        Sheffield    9c   326   
Holmes    James         Sheffield    9c   326   


Online rosie99

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Re: Newbie brick wall Holmes, Sheffield, Liverpool, Leeds
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 02 September 18 17:14 BST (UK) »
I really do appreciate your responses but Nellie Havenhand whereabouts were well established. Itís her mother Annie Elizabeth Holmes and her father that are the mystery.

It helps us to have this information when trying to track the family backwards. 
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk