Author Topic: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?  (Read 1120 times)

Offline Deesider

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Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« on: Monday 29 October 18 19:34 GMT (UK) »
My earliest known ancestor John Audley was buried 2nd October 1811 at Shotwick, Cheshire, He was described as of Ledsham (3 miles from Shotwick). The only information I have to his age comes from his Marriage licences to his second wife. Which says he was aged 50 on 20th September 1794. This suggests that my earliest ancestor was born between 21st September1743 and 20th September 1744.  I know that this John Audley was in Shotwick in March 1794 as that was when he buried his first wife Elizabeth.

There is a baptism for a John Audley 17th January 1744/45 at Nantwich, Cheshire (28 miles from Shotwick)  This John Audley is recorded as entering Manchester Grammar School in June 1756.

I am trying to ascertain whether the above two John Audleys could be the same person; but there is a big BUT.

The John Audley who was baptised in 1744/45 at Nantwich had a sister Jane Audley who never married and who wrote her will on 25th October 1816. (5 years after the burial of John Audley at Shotwick) She was buried 8th November 1816. In her will she states (amongst other items) ‘I give to William Tomlinson, the younger of Nantwich, gent £200, in trust to invest same and apply proceeds for the benefit of my brother John Audley for his life, and after his decease the said interest between the two children of my late brother Ralph’. Wlliam Tomlinson the younger benefits from the will to the value of £20.

This will suggests that there must be two John Audleys in Cheshire around that time: Can anybody find the baptism or the 1st marriage record for the John Audley (married Elizabeth) who was buried in Shotwick in 1811?. Also can anybody find the burial of the John Audley who was baptised in 1744/45 in Nantwich?

The will also suggests that the John Audley, who was baptised at Nantwich had no children as after John Audley’s death the intrest on the £200 was to go to the children of her deceased brother (Ralph).  The John who was  buried at Shotwick definitely had one son, and possibly three more.

Can anybody explain why Jane Audley would give approximately half her wealth to  a William Tomlinson for him to invest for the benefit of her brother John Audley? Why not give the money direct to John Audley?

All help appreciated
Many Thanks
Brian Audley

Offline emeltom

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Re: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« Reply #1 on: Monday 29 October 18 20:34 GMT (UK) »
The John Audley who married Mary Humphries by Licence at Shotwick is down on the marriage licence as being a Brickmaker, residence Ledsham, Neston.

There is a burial for a John Audley in Nantwich in 1824 aged 81, which gives a year of birth of 1743. This fits with the John Audley baptised 17 January 1744 in Nantwich, son of George Audley Jnr, Attorney. Jane Audley was baptised 1756 and Ralph Audley 1747, both children of George Audley Jnr, Attorney. Dad being an Attorney also fits nicely with John's school record at Manchester Grammar School.

Would the son of an Attorney be a Brickmaker, unless of course he owned the Brickworks.

Jane's Will certainly implies that John did not have any children.

I cannot see another baptism around 1744 nor can I see a marriage to an Elizabeth or a death for John in 1811. If your John died 1811 he cannot be the John born 1744 in Nantwich with sister Jane as he definitely would not have been included in her Will 1816 if he was already dead.

Therefore I think you can discount John 1744 of Nantwich as being yours, but I cannot see anyone to replace him with.

Emeltom
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Offline Deesider

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Re: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« Reply #2 on: Monday 29 October 18 21:35 GMT (UK) »
Hi emeltom,
Many thanks for your prompt reply.
I have clearly missed the burial for the John Audley in Nantwich in 1824. Can you please advise the source of your information?

Regarding the burial of John Audley in Shotwick in 1811. I have taken the information from the Parish Register. In one well known subscription website the burial is transcribed as John Ridley but if one looks at the image it is clearly (to me). John Audley.

Everything else you say is logical and confirms my thoughts that there were two people called John Audley, The big question now is where was  the John Audley, (whose second marriage was to Mary Humphries at Shotwick) baptised and where did he marry his first wife Elizabeth. His second wife appears to have been buried at Shotwick in `1827 as Mary Auldley.

Thanks for your help
Regards
Brian Audley

Offline emeltom

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Re: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 30 October 18 09:19 GMT (UK) »
The 1824 death is on familysearch.

Since posting I did manage to find the 1811 death, but still cannot find a baptism or first marriage in Cheshire or anywhere else for that matter.

Emeltom
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Online DCB

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Re: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 30 October 18 11:12 GMT (UK) »
May be nothing, but a John Allday married Elizabeth Whitehead in Neston on 27th December 1764.

They had several children baptised in Shotwick, giving the abode as Ledsham:-
John 1765
William 1770
Charles 1772
Samuel 1775
William 1777

I can't see any further records of the family and was wondering if the name may have changed to Audley?

He made a mark on the marriage bond and age 50 upwards.

The only near name for a baptism is John Allaby in Bebington in 1739.

David

Offline emeltom

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Re: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 30 October 18 12:16 GMT (UK) »
Allowing for regional accents and illiteracy that is all very possible. The John born 1739 had a father Richard and lived in Poulton.

Emeltom
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Re: Was there two people called John Audley circa 1744 to circa 1811?
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 30 October 18 17:46 GMT (UK) »
Hi DCB and emelton,

Sorry I have not been able to get back to you sooner we have been looking after our grandson today.

DCB you have made a great under statement when you say "May be nothing but......" my wife has had to peel me off the ceiling!!

The first study into the Audley surname was published in 3 volumes in the early 1930s and all the research papers are in Liverpool University library. That research concluded that 4 brothers moved to Liverpool in the late 1790s. I quote there names  Samuel Audley (1775 - 1840) ;  John Audley (1767? - 1816); William Audley (1776? - 1833) and Charles Audley (1773? - 1827). Those names match perfectly with those stated by DCB  but with a slightly different surname. 

I have seen many alternative spellings of Audley before but previously come across Allday.

You do not know how much of a discovery you have made.

Many Thanks
Regards
Brian