People giving incorrect birth places?

[Fraser178]

William Royle left a will:
20th April 1837 ...will of William Royle late of Clarendon Street Chorlton upon Medlock in the County of Lancaster Baker and Shopkeeper deceased was proved and Admon Granted unto Jane Fraser the Sole Exor.

Short and sweet
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6PF3-HNJ?i=31&cat=126866

The Testator died the Fourth day of March 1837

Another amazing find there, I've never had too much experience with Wills in my research before. It would explain why Jane could look after herself for another 20 odd years despite being widowed.

possible for Hannah in 1851 has another sister

89 Reather Street, St Georges, Manchester HO107/2230 folio 10 pg 12
Ann Frazer head 28 silk winder
Eliza sister 23 silk winder
both born Manchester

Looks like the transcribers don't cope with the z with a tail and think it's a g, so Frazer becomes Frager.
1841 place of birth choice was in county, Ireland, Scotland or Foreign Parts so the Ireland could be an error.

 

Andrew did also name one of his daughters Elizabeth/Eliza so that could also fit well with being his sisters name (Jane, Isabella, Mary Hannah/Marianne/Mary Ann and Elizabeth all being Andrews daughters would match exactly with all these siblings).

Although this does leave odd jumps between Jane Frazer's children; Isabella (1807), Andrew (1809), Jane (1811), Hannah (1822ish), Eliza (1828). I Imagine theres more just haven't come across them yet.

You're right there, Fraser has to be one of the worst names I've seen transcribed. Fraser, Frazier, Frazer, Frasier, Frayer, Frager, Freyser etc!
I did have a look at the 1841 input and it looks more like an 'S' to me so that could be the case.

[Fraser178]

Think you can rule that one out, Osprey - Eliza married 1 May 1851 - address given as 89 Reather Street with father named as Joseph Frazer, shoemaker.

William

That would make some sense as Jane would of been getting on a bit to have another child by 1828!

[Regorian]

There were two aspects here. I've noticed it in my researches. One was changes in districts in the Census returns, the other, although isolated was deliberate, some people resented intrusion into their privacy. I have a perfect example in my wider family. If I can find it, I'll post it. Long liver, birth places all different. 

[Fraser178]

There were two aspects here. I've noticed it in my researches. One was changes in districts in the Census returns, the other, although isolated was deliberate, some people resented intrusion into their privacy. I have a perfect example in my wider family. If I can find it, I'll post it. Long liver, birth places all different.

Thanks, I look forward to having a look at it. I suppose it also depends who answers the census really, his wife could of filled in the census and simply thought he was born in Manchester when that could simply be false.

I have just found the marriage record of Robert Grainger (Jane Frazer's son, the sibling who wasn't buried in the family plot) and one of the Witness is a Royle (cant see the forename). But it appears the Royles are every where!

[trish1120]

Lots of progress made whilst I slept and then went to work

Looks to me that siblings married siblings;

23 Dec 1846 St John the Evangelist, Blackpool, Lancashire
James Haffenden - of full age, Butler, Bachelor, Blackpool
Mary Ann Fraser - of full age, Spinster, Blackpool
Groom's Father: William Haffenden, Gardener
Bride's Father: Alexander Fraser, Mechanic
Witness: J. Fraser; Hannah Fraser

Sorry it this has already been found.

Another possible child and witness to above Marriage?

19 Nov 1837 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
John Fraser - Full age, Stone Mason, Bachelor, Norfolk St
Janet Dow - (X), Full age, Widow, Norfolk St
Groom's Father: Alexander Fraser, Labourer
Bride's Father: John Smart, Stone Mason

2 Baptisms St Peter, Liverpool;
ALEXANDER Fraser  25 Apr 1838
JOHN JAMES Frazer 21 Jul 1840
Parents JOHN/JANE, John a Stone Mason

[Fraser178]

Lots of progress made whilst I slept and then went to work

Looks to me that siblings married siblings;

23 Dec 1846 St John the Evangelist, Blackpool, Lancashire
James Haffenden - of full age, Butler, Bachelor, Blackpool
Mary Ann Fraser - of full age, Spinster, Blackpool
Groom's Father: William Haffenden, Gardener
Bride's Father: Alexander Fraser, Mechanic
Witness: J. Fraser; Hannah Fraser

Sorry it this has already been found.

Fantastic! This is new information aswell.
So thats Isabella, Andrew, Jane, Mary Ann and Hannah!
Cant seem to find any trace of Alexander at all though, interesting to see that some of them left Manchester aswell.

[trish1120]

Go back and read my last posting as I just added extra info you may have not seen

[trish1120]

1851 Census
Toxteth Parks, Lancs
John Dow, 27, Head, Mar, Forge Labourer, born Scotland
Mary Ann Dow, 26, Wife, Mar, born Toxteth Park
John Dow, 4, Son
Jane Dow, 1, Daug
Alice Gray, 36, Mother in Law, Widow
Alexander FRASER, 13, Brother, Errand Boy, born Toxteth Park******

So it appears John Dow must be the Son of Jane Dow, Widow, who married John Frazer 1837.

Johns Marriage to Mary Ann Gray has his Father as Charles.

1841 Census the Family seems to be under Dow;
Jane Dow   40 Charwoman, born Scotland
John Dow   15 Labourer, born Scotland
Charles Dow 10
Jane Dow   7
Alexander Dow 3****
Last 3 all born in County*

1861 Alexander is a Nephew of Barbara Smart;
Barbara Smart
James H Smart
George Smart
Agnes Smart
Margaret Smart
John Smart
Alexander Fraser, 23, born Liverpool, Lancashire

[trish1120]

14 Apr 1865 St Michael in the Hamlet, Aigburth, Lancashire
Alexander Frazer - 27, Hammersmith, Bachelor, Mann St
Margaret White - 20, Spinster, Mann St
Father: John Frazer, Stone Mason
Father: John White, Fireman
Witnesses: William Wood; Mary Wood

Off to bed again