Jeremiah Wallace of Easky

[lmgnz]

Hi Kerry

Yes I think you first need an autosomal DNA test to narrow down the options for your paternal line. But also to see who you match through your Nairn 2x gt grandmother. 

In terms of Nairns your autosomal DNA from your 2x gt grandmother will be enough to identify some of your Nairn relatives. Having trees for all the Nairns in Sligo will mean you hopefully will be able to find and place those matches. You may find matches in families of your 2x gt grandmother's cousins though they would be more distant ( less shared DNA) than families of her siblings.

Though I find you probably have to keep following hints down those trees to the levels of grandparents of the testing generation to be sure who they are (if they have trees or can answer who their grandparents were/are.)

If your unknown 2x gt grandfather had other children, then those at the same generation as you would be your 3rd cousins.

In terms of yDNA the only Nairns who might show up matching your yDNA test would be other direct male line offspring of your gt grandfather, if they also tested. But your yDNA would not be the same haplogroup as any Nairns of earlier generations so you would not show as a match to them with yDNA. Though you could with autosomal DNA.

You would be the same haplogroup as any half brothers, paternal uncles, father etc of whatever surname of your gt grandfather. If you have hint towards McCallum that could easily be confirmed or denied through yDNA.

I believe there is a Scottish interest group who could probably help narrow down the possible surnames of your 2x gt grandfather but honestly I do not know how they would do that. My Grahams have a rare haplogroup only commonly found in Scottish Border clans.

 In my own family it was a brother of my gt grandfather whose son turned to be the grandfather of my DNA match whose father had been adopted.

I first found this 3rd cousin because he showed up late last year in my Ancestry matches as a probable 4th-6th cousin, and shared matches with my other Graham family matches. Only two of those shared matches were definite Grahams as I had not at that time made contact with others whose trees had not reached our common ancestors (my Graham 2x gt grandparents). I do have 3 people in the wider group who share my Graham 3x gt grandparents.

Due to Covid, one of those uncertain families updated their tree last year and I could then identify which of my gt grandfather's siblings they belonged to. And I made contact through Rootschat with the sister of another match (surname Graham) who had died before I found our DNA match.

As it happened one of the two shared matches who I could identify turned out (after further investigation) to be a 1st cousin of my new 3rd cousin. So their shared ancestor was my gt grandfather's nephew, and hence they shared much more DNA with each other than with me.

It was my match, the closeness to the shared match who turned out to be a cousin, and matches to the family of his spouse, that identified to which of my gt grandfather's brothers the adopted family belonged. You can not get that information from yDNA.

I was the first to confirm this adopted line belonged to our Graham family. The y111 DNA test confirmed this beyond any doubt.

Though my brother and our 3rd cousin match on the yDNA level they do not match on autosomal DNA. So without that autosomal match to me we would not know how they match.

I do not match the 3rd cousin's sister who was the first to DNA test to see if they could identify their adopted father's paternal family. And my brother does not match to her brother on autosomal DNA just on yDNA. 

However one of the adopted family does match a 5th cousin of mine who shares a 4x gt grandfather in the Graham line with me, father of my 3x gt grandmother. So this match to the adopted family is  my (and their) 5th cousin. I do not happen to have a DNA match that person but we have other evidence.

The DNA gaps are much more frequent at that level (5th cousin or greater with shared 4x gt grandparents) with fewer people who have enough shared DNA to show as a match, but they do happen. And in Sligo with so few protestant and many protestant family inter-marriages, I think it happens more often, as you may share two lines of the same DNA a generation or two apart, doubling the amount of DNA that you share.

The only problem is that you might not know why you share these more distant matches who appear closer than expected, as you do not have a paper trail.

Cheers

Linda

[lmgnz]

I can add that I have at least 2 DNA matches in the family of a sibling of Mary Wallace my 2x gt grandmother.

Both belong to her (presumed) brother John Wallace born 1797 in Ballymeeny Easky and died in Ontario Canada. Our shared Ancestor is my 3x gt grandfather Jeremiah Wallace. The amount of DNA that we share is very low so I doubt if I would show as a DNA match to anyone more distant than Mary's siblings. Unless they have double lines of DNA. E.g Mary's niece, Ann Jane Wallace married my 2x gt grandfather's brother James Livingston. And yes I do have a DNA match in that family.

Cheers.

[Kerry Nairn]

Hi Linda.

Thank you for your very informative and detailed reply.

Im not a very scientific person, so i find the whole Dna thing pretty complicated at times.I think i will probably end up doing both an Autosomal & Y test, maybe just the 37 Marker Test instead of the more expensive 111 Marker Test.

One of my Irish born Great Uncles, Robert Nairn 1896 - 1965 , born in Co Meath, who came out to N.Z in 1922 apparently always claimed that our branch of Nairns were related to the ''Lords Nairne''.I never knew Robert , but i did know his Son,& he told me that his Father was always Adamant about that.I have a copy of a letter Robert wrote to his Nephew in England from 1955, claiming this connection.
My research hasnt turned up anything or even a hint of anything as the Irish records pre 1800 are almost non existent ! I guess its possible ? , the ''Lords Nairne''of Strathord,Perthshire were Jacobites & were Persecuted by the English for thier active involvement in the jacobite rebellions , 1715,1745 .Its a ''riches to rags'' story ,where they had their estates confiscated and were almost reduced to poverty . After the battle of  Culloden, 1746 they were Banished to France.My Great Uncle claims some of the Family also fled to Ireland at that time, and the earliest record of Nairns in Co Sligo to be found is 1749, just 3 years after Culloden, so who knows, maybe one day it could be confirmed through Dna ? 
One of that Family (Lords Nairne) married a Daughter ,of Graham of Inchbrakie, Scotland from memory.

regards, Kerry.

[Kerry Nairn]

Hi Linda.

Robert Nairne - 1st Lord Nairne, married Margaret Graham, daughter of Graham of Inchbrakie.

regards, Kerry

[lmgnz]

Hi Kerry

Thanks for that. Chances are that any Graham who married a Lord belonged to the other Graham clan which included the Duke of Montrose. They are unlikely to be the same yDNA haplogroup as the border Grahams haplogroup which predated the Normans.

There is one way a yDNA test will get you back to Scottish Nairns and that is if you find someone (male) or several someones, directly descended though the male lines from the Sligo Nairn families. And then either persuade them to yDNA test or help pay for them to test. Or better yet find that someone has already yDNA tested.

Basically that is how the one name studies work. They try to find the origins of everyone bearing the surname of interest. Which may involve tracking down people to DNA test. Sometimes they have a donation fund to help purchase or upgrade the tests.

However it does not look like there is a Nairn one name project  group in FTDNA. I just typed Nairn into the search field and only two came up. Both include Nairn in the names of interest.

Scottish DNA   11967   members

The project was split into Y-DNA and mtDNA projects in Spring 2016. If you are interested in using DNA for genealogical purposes and would like to find out about your deeper ancestral origins the read more...

Your Scottish Ancestry   4689    members

Alasdair Macdonald is Scottish representative for Family Tree DNA. This project is for interpretation and analysis of DNA results including Y-DNA, mtDNA and Family Finder. Alasdair offers an ... read more...

 I read more and this is the website.

https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/your-scottish-ancestry

As this one specifically includes autosomal DNA tests (Family Finder) I would go to that website and ask Alastair for advice. Explain about your gt grandfather but that you are interested in finding out more about the origins of the Sligo Nairns.

Alastair Macdonald may be able to tell you if any of the Sligo Nairns have yDNA tested already.

Cheers

Linda

[Kerry Nairn]

Thanks Linda.