SALLY BETTS (nee ECCLESTONE).

[gracol]

Hello Sheila,
Thanks so much for all that interesting information.
I wonder if I could take up your offer of help ?
My Great Great Grandfather was JOHN COLLINS who married in Hucknall Torkard in 1843.He married MARY GUTTRIDGE,who was illegitimate,on the  marriage record  no fathers name is given for either.
John Collins according to later censuses was born around 1818 in Hucknall Torkard.In 1841 he was boarding in Beasdale Lane Hucknall Torkard.
I cannot find a birth record which could lead me back further.
Best regards
Colin

[Dizzifish]

Hello Colin,

There is this baptism which seems to fit.....

Baptism - HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene - 18th Aug 1816
John Thorp - mother Mary COLLINS - spinster

I will see if I can find what happened to Mary  Collins.

[Dizzifish]

I can't see a marriage for a Mary Collins in Hucknall, I was hoping she might have married a Mr. Thorp.

It is possible she married in a different parish, but none I found that I thought would be her.

There were three baptisms for  Mary Collins' at Hucknall.....

Baptisms - HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene
20th March 1743 - Mary  - parents  = John & Elizabeth COLLINS
8th Jan 1797 - Mary - parents  = Joseph & Elizabeth COLLINS
24th Aug 1828 - - parents  = Samuel & Mary COLLINS, occupation, Labourer in manufacture.

Marriage at HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene - 9th Dec 1793
Joseph COLLINS & Elizabeth DAYKIN

I think this would the burial of Joseph & Elizabeth's daughter...... also a candidate for the mother of John Collins 

Burial at HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene - 24th May 1817
Mary COLLINS -  19yrs

I also spotted this burial, which will be one of yours?
Burial - HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene - 20th Feb 1858
Elizabeth G. COLLINS -13 yrs - Notes: Elizabeth Guttridge.

[Ladyhawk]

Who witnessed the 1843 marriage of John & Mary?

Is this your John & Mary Collins on census

Charles Betts   51
Hannah Betts   52
John Coullins   34 Hucknall son in law
Mary Collins   28 dau
Elizabeth Collins   6 granddaughter
Martha Collins   3 granddaughter
1851 census

Name   Age
John Collins   43
Mary Collins   38
Martha Collins   13
John Collins   10
Samuel Collins   6
1861census

Name   Age
John Collins   54
Mary Collins   48
John Collins   19
Samuel Collins   16
Charles Betts   70 father

COLLINS, ELIZABETH  GUTTERIDGE   mmn GUTTERIDGE   
 1844  J Quarter in BASFORD  Volume 15  Page 441      

COLLINS, MARTHA mmn   GUTTERIDGE   
1847  J Quarter in BASFORD  Volume 15  Page 431

COLLINS, JOHN mmn   GUTTRIDGE   
 1851  D Quarter in BASFORD  Volume 15  Page 569      

COLLINS, SAMUEL mmn   GUTTRIDGE   
1854  D Quarter in BASFORD  Volume 07B  Page 114      

Name   Age
Charles Betts   40
Hannah Betts   40
Mary Gutrige   15
1841 census

   

[Dizzifish]

Here is a little bit more re your Guttridge side.... some you probably already know?

Baptisms at Wymeswold, Leicestershire.

Mary's mothers baptism =

Baptism - Wymeswold, Leicestershire.
Hannah dau of William & Elizabeth GUTRIDGE - 26th March 1798
 ~~
Baptisms - Wymeswold, Leicestershire.

Register entry 254  - 8th Aug 1824
Mary, illegitimate Dau. of Hannah GUTTRIDGE - abode, Wymeswold.

Register Entry 255 - 8th Aug 1824
Harriet - parents = John & Elizabeth GUTTRIDGE - abode, Wymeswold.
~~

Marriage at Wymeswold  - 23rd November 1784 - after banns.
William GUTTRIDGE, bach'r and Elizabeth HICKLING, spinster of this parish.
Witnesses = John Hickling & Thomas Horsley.

Marriage at Prestwold, Leicestershire - 18th Aug 1823 - after banns.
John GUTTRIDGE of the parish of Wymeswold, Leicestershire.
& Elizabeth BROWN of Burton.
Witnesses = Joseph Brown & Charles Monk.

NOTE: John Guttridge was Hannah Guttridge (Betts) brother - baptised at Wymeswold, 16th Nov 1803
John & his family are in Wymeswold in 1851
 ~ ~ ~

[Dizzifish]

Hello Colin,

I had been looking to give you the burial dates for John COLLINS and his wife Mary and the burials for Charles & Hannah BETTS...... which led me to realise you have the wrong parents for Charles Betts born 1799....

Looking at census etc for this family I was curious as to how you came to the conclusion that Charles BETTS was baptised in Sutton in Ashfield 1799 and his father was Francis?

Tracing the line of Francis Betts & Sarah Ecclestone as being the parents Charles Betts will be the wrong line.

But I will let you see what you make of it.......


Burials - HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene
22nd Jan 1880 -  John COLLINS- 63yrs

I can't see a burial for Mary Collins....

16th March 1875 - Charles BETTS - 74yrs (born abt 1801)

I think there is a error re the burial transcription for Hannah Betts at Hucknall, which has her age as 17yrs old
the GRO have her age as 69yrs

7th April 1867 - Hanah BETTS - 17yrs

If I get chance in the next couple of weeks I will try and check that entry.


I believe this to be the correct information for Charles.......


Marriage of parents =

GREASLEY St Mary - 10th April 1793
Charles BETTS & Sarah ALLEN

Note: Phillimore' marriages give Charles Betts of the parish of Selston
~ ~

Children of Charles BETTS & Sarah ALLEN

Baptisms - HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene

George BETT - 12 Jan 1794 ............ his burial at Hucknall,  15 April 1794, son of Charles & Sarah
John BETT - 19 March 1795
George BETTS - 30 April 1797
Charles BETTS - 4 Aug 1799
William BETTS - 18 Oct 1801
Samuel BETTS - 3 March 1805
Joseph BETTS - 8 Nov 1807
~ ~ ~ ~

Burial = HUCKNALL TORKARD St Mary Magdalene

21 Oct 1834 Charles - BETTS - 66yrs  - born abt 1768

Three burials at Hucknall for Sarah Betts..... this is the most likely.
17 Aug 1841  - Sarah BETTS - 73yrs
   
Note: In 1841 Sarah Betts is next door/ same page as Charles & Hannah Betts & Mary Guttridge/Gutrige.
Living with two of her sons in Betts Row ! I think the George Betts aged 70 is likely to be Sarah's brother in law.

[Ladyhawk]

Looking at census etc for this family I was curious as to how you came to the conclusion that Charles BETTS was baptised in Sutton in Ashfield 1799 and his father was Francis?

I think that Charles Betts possibly married Elizabeth Springfellow
on 10 Apr 1821 in Sutton In Ashfield

Charles Betts 29 Dec 1799 Sutton in Ashfield, Nottinghamshire
Father:   Francis Betts  Mother: Sally

1851 c HO107; Piece: 2130; Folio: 287; Page: 35
Charles Betts 51 Sutton in Ashfield occ Framework Knitter
Elizabeth Betts 51 wife
Samuel Betts 13 son
Sarah Betts 3 Grandaughter

[Dizzifish]

Hi Ladyhawk,

You are right with the information regarding the Sutton in Ashfield Betts family and I am familiar with them.
It was only looking at further information that I realised Colin's Betts family came from Hucknall Torkard.

The Charles Betts living in Hucknall has Colin's great great grandfather John Collins living with him.

The correct Charles Betts was baptised at Hucknall, 4th Aug 1799 - parents Charles Betts & Sarah Allen

1851 - HO107 /2127 /Folio 606 /Page1 - Butlers Hill , Hucknall Torkard, Nottinghamshire.

[gracol]

Thanks very much for all your replies.
Have looked at the ones regarding the "Collins".
Did find the baptism of John Thorp Collins,Thorp doesn't appear in his census records or on his death record in 1880.Do you think it's that unusual that he never used his middle name and it is not on his death record ? I'm inclined to think this must be my John Collins !
Noticed there are quite a few Thorp records in Hucknall.
Thanks for finding his mother, Mary's, baptism,also the sad record of her death at 19. Will add these to my tree,
From family memories,many years ago,John Collins was involved in the setting up of churches in Hucknall,and I have found records to verify this.Elizabeth Gutteridge Collins is one of mine,her brother John Collins (1851-1919),my great grandfather ,was very active in Hucknall,particularly the Co-operative Society,various school,burial boards,churches etc.it's good to find newspaper reports that personalise the records.
Will now look into the comments re the Betts & Gutteridges .
Thanks again.
Colin