Author Topic: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.  (Read 466 times)

Offline JamesDMcBust

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Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« on: Saturday 05 January 19 20:00 GMT (UK) »
Hello

I am researching the WINDSOR family of Welshampton in the late 18th century and into the 19th century and I would be grateful for some help in identifying the maiden name of the mother of children John b.1810, Margaret b.1812, Thomas b.1813,  Ann b.1816 and Sarah b.1818, all baptised in Welsh Hampton.

Baptism records gives their father as John Windsor and mother as Anne. The baptisms took place in the parish of Welsh Hampton.

I can find Anne Windsor on the 1841 census with husband John and (granddaughter?) Anne born 1833 living at Beaumere, Welsh Hampton, Ellesmere. Anne is with her son, Thomas, in the 1851 census as she had been widowed on 22 March 1850. I am confident I have correctly identified her burial on 25 Jan 1865 at Welshampton.

I've done a full search for a marriage for John and Anne from 1800 - 1810  but can find nothing. The only one that I tentatively considered, then dismissed, was the marriage of John Windsor to an Ann Hughes on 10 July 1809 at Guilden Sutton, Cheshire (John was in service) and marriage was by licence. 

Can anyone help me with this?  Thank you.

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Offline Lins_Australia

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 30 January 19 02:19 GMT (UK) »
The 1841 census location of Beaumere I suspect is Balmer Heath - in the burial records for this family - it gets shown as Balmer.
The Windsor families in this area using the Welshampton church - may well be from Hanmer, Flintshire.  The Windsor names baptised at Hanmer in the 1780s can be found as burials at Welshampton.
The John Windsor baptised at Hanmer 29 Feb 1784 to parents John & Margaret has the family location as being Bettisfield.  The same locality as Balmer Heath.
This doesnt answer your question as to the marriage of John Windsor and Ann - but when you see a 'cousin ?' - Francis Windsor (1784) - of Hanmer - marrying at Ellesmere in 1808 - and his burial is at Welshampton in 1749 (being of "The Balmer") - you are seeing a few pieces of this family jigsaw.
Cheers
Lindsay

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Offline solidrock

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 30 January 19 03:08 GMT (UK) »
Maybe..

John Windsor  m  Ann Raven.  28 Jun 1802, St John the Baptist, Newcastle upon Tyne.
Forget that he would be to young.

Offline emeltom

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 30 January 19 11:26 GMT (UK) »
Any particular reason as to why you dismissed the 1809 marriage at Guilden Sutton? It gives John's birth year as 1784 and there was a John Windsor baptised 1784 in Hanmer to John and Margaret.

Emeltom
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Offline JamesDMcBust

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 30 January 19 13:14 GMT (UK) »
Thank you for your comments.
The only reason I discounted the couple married at Guilden Sutton was a considerable distance from Welshampton. However the baptism in 1794 to John and Margaret does fit this timeframe.  Is it possible that the marriage in Guilden Sutton was by licence because either or both parties were born in a different area/county?

Offline emeltom

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 30 January 19 13:34 GMT (UK) »
I don't think that the fact that one or other of the parties being born in another county would warrant the need for a Licence, unless they were unable to comply with the need to have spent some weeks living in the parish where the wedding takes place, and both John and Ann had done that as the Licence states that they have both lived there for four weeks or more.

Interesting also that John and Ann called one of their daughters Margaret.

Emeltom
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Offline Lins_Australia

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 30 January 19 23:50 GMT (UK) »
The marriage licence for John Winsor (sic) has him as a servant.
The co-signatory to that licence was Charles Woodcock - in the document named a Gentleman.
Charles Woodcock was himself married in 1809 at Tarvin - again by licence - and in that document he is named as a Farmer - of Guilden-Sutton.  (His marriage signature matches the John Windsor licence document signature).
With John Windsor at Welshampton being an Agricultural Labourer - might it be the case that in 1809 he was in that occupation at Guilden-Sutton ?
Was the term 'servant' considered a bit more classy than Ag Lab ?
John Windsor being originally of Hanmer - in that era - in the Diocese of Chester - is able to get a licence if he had been working in the area for some time with the support of Charles Woodcock ?

Offline JamesDMcBust

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 31 January 19 11:59 GMT (UK) »
In researching my ancestors I've generally found most of my 'lot' living in the countryside were recorded on census records as Ag Labs.  Occasionally in certain places where quarrying took place, the same people might be listed as masons.

I think I've only come across the term "servant" when it refers to someone who worked and lived within a large household, as opposed to an agricultural labourer who might have worked for a landowner/gentleman farmer but who lived in a tied cottage.

I happen to know Guilden Sutton quite well it being only about 4 miles from where I now live. Nowadays the village almost touches the suburbs of Chester but presumably back in 1809 it would have contained a handful of large houses, farms and farmcottages. 

I do think we have the right couple.  I'm thinking that perhaps John Windsor would have been pleased to accept a post of "servant" to Charles Woodcock. It just might have been something higher than the boy who cleaned the boots!  I'm going to look more into Charles Woodcock and see if I can find where he lived.  Perhaps Anne Hughes was born in/around Guilden Sutton? A bit more digging is required.

Thanks for everyone's help.

Offline jillrose

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Re: Marriage for John WINDSOR and Ann, Welshampton.
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 02 February 19 11:37 GMT (UK) »
Just wondering if you have these marriages in your records? from Clwyd FHS transcriptions:

Overton

 2 Feb 1862 mar by Banns of
          John WINDSOR (blacksmith) ba/of full age of Llangollen s/o John WINDSOR (lab)
          & Emma ROBERTS sp/ofa otp d/o John ROBERTS (bricklayer)

19 Jan 1865 mar by Lic of
         John WINDSOR (lab) wdr/ofa of Welshhampton s/o Benjamin WINDSOR (lab)
         & Hannah COLLEY wid/ofa otp d/o James LARGE (lab)

There are many other Windsor entries on the website clwydsurnames.org.uk

Hope this may be of interest.