Author Topic: Alice Sarah Wyllie  (Read 589 times)

Offline Forfarian

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Alice Sarah Wyllie
« on: Tuesday 22 January 19 14:23 GMT (UK) »
There's a grave in Durban (Ordnance Road) Military Cemetery: Heanan, Sapper, John Rupert, ME/32, South African Mounted Engineers. 21 November 1916. Age 20. Son of Col Charles Oris Heanan and Alice Sarah Wyllie Heanan. Grave Ref C 24.

I am looking for Alice Sarah Wyllie, born in London on 23 April 1871, parents John Evans Wyllie and Sarah Jane Bucktrout. The last sighting I have of Alice was as a witness in a court case in 1886 when her father, an innkeeper, was charged with permitting drunkenness in the Bugle, Fareham, Hampshire, England.

I can't find any record of her marriage or death in England.

Does anyone know if she was the wife of Charles Oris Heanan?

I have reams of information about Alice's family, so please don't expend time or effort in tracing her backwards. It's what happened to her after 1886 that I am now interested in.

For the avoidance of duplication, the background is in his thread
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=803213.0

Researching

AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; GUTHRIE, Angus; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes/Mortlach; MENDUM, England; MOLLISON, Lethnot; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOR(R)I/E/Y, Shotts; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Angus; YOUNG, Keith

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Offline Catherine Wait

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 23 January 19 08:22 GMT (UK) »
Morning, have you looked at FS in South Africa for the information about John Rupert Heanan? seems to be a information confusion!!! There is a death notice for John died 21/11/1916 Durban which is correct to your grave, but John's parents are listed as Carlos Chris Heanan, deceased, birth unknown England and Alice Sylvia Heanan nee Wyllie also deceased.. The death notice is signed by C ? Heanan brother of the deceased.  Not sure if this is your Sarah?

Did a very quick look in Natal records and didn't find a Alice Sarah Heanan nee Wyllie, are you sure she came to South Africa?

Regards
Catherine
Ridley (Northumberland)
Turnbull (Northumberland))
Hatley (London)
McFadden (Donegal and Tasmania)

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Offline Forfarian

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 23 January 19 12:48 GMT (UK) »
Thank you.

No, I am not sure whether or not Alice Sarah went to South Africa. I have no confirmed sightings of her at all after 1886, and there is no marriage or death of Alice S* Wyllie in FreeBMD.

I have now, and thank you for the pointer, looked at FS for John Rupert. I had tried FS for the father and for Alice, but hadn't looked there for the son.

There are three listings, of which the third is the most detailed but for the surname being spelled Heanon instead of Heanan.

The first one, signed by the brother, gives their mother's name as Alice Sylvia Heanan, maiden name Wyllie.

It looks quite likely that my Alice Sarah Wyllie was indeed the wife of Charles Oris, or Carlos Chris, Heanan, and mother of John Rupert and C*, but I think I'd like a bit more evidence before being sure.

(The index to the third one says he died in 'Base, Solomon Islands' but the original reads 'Base Hospital Depot'  ??? I've come across curious transcriptions before but that one is up there with the best!)
Researching

AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; GUTHRIE, Angus; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes/Mortlach; MENDUM, England; MOLLISON, Lethnot; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOR(R)I/E/Y, Shotts; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Angus; YOUNG, Keith

Offline Catherine Wait

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 23 January 19 16:24 GMT (UK) »
Hi, you do have a interesting one here!!!
 I think John Rupert died in the base hospital on Solomon Islands (why South African military are there in 1916, I have not a clue!!but I am curious), on the death notice it said
1.  the body was at the Durban City Hall (my first thought was a troop ship arriving back home and bodies housed in the hall for burial, but expected more than one), November in Durban gets HOT and humid, so burial would be quick.  Odd that the body was returned to South Africa?/?
2.  His normal place of residence was Johannesburg. (The heat and quick burial would explain why he was buried in Durban, port of arrival back in South Africa)
3.  His probate was issued in the Cape Province, again odd.  The documents are in Cape Town Repository (KAB) source:MOOC Type:Leer Volume:6/9/875 and 13/1/3138 Estate, and Liquidation / distribution account.  Should you want copies, you would need to contact them directly, I understand they do not allow the public to make copies anymore.  I think this might be worth the effort - It might give information on parents as well as distribution to follow up.
4.  I would assume he enlisted in the military in South Africa, you could try his military records.  The bad news is I have been trying for 2+ years to get military records and still waiting!!!

I extended the search of any Heanan / Heanon and found nothing else - wonder if his parents did came out here at all, however the death notrice does give a timeline of sorts for the parents as they both are deceased by 1916.

Good Luck
Catherine
Ridley (Northumberland)
Turnbull (Northumberland))
Hatley (London)
McFadden (Donegal and Tasmania)

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 23 January 19 17:34 GMT (UK) »
Copy of death certificate attached.

I have no idea where they got Solomon Islands from. There's no way they would ship a decomposing body from the Solomon Islands to Durban, and even if they did, it would surely have taken far more than six days to get there?



Researching

AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; GUTHRIE, Angus; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes/Mortlach; MENDUM, England; MOLLISON, Lethnot; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOR(R)I/E/Y, Shotts; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Angus; YOUNG, Keith

Offline Catherine Wait

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 24 January 19 06:56 GMT (UK) »
Morning, I absolutely agree, the Solomon Island is a wild goose chase.  I can find nothing to support that at all.  Did find information on the formation of the SAE and their deployment in WW1, they served in South West Africa, East Africa and France/Belgium.

I think to proof your Alice Sarah / Sylvia problem would be to somehow find births for the two brothers.  If the father was military, campaigns in that time?

Sorry that I'm not much help!!

Happy huntting.
Catherine
Ridley (Northumberland)
Turnbull (Northumberland))
Hatley (London)
McFadden (Donegal and Tasmania)

Offline ShaunJ

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 24 January 19 07:54 GMT (UK) »
The brother (CD Heanan) is referenced several times in NAAIRS as a civil servant. He seems likely to be the C Dominic Heanan who appears on the passenger list of the "Berrima" arrived London from Cape Town in May 1923, aged 30.
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ShaunJ

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 24 January 19 08:01 GMT (UK) »
Charles Dominic Heanan served as a 2nd Lieutenant in the RAF 1918-1920. Selected in South Africa.
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ShaunJ

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Re: Alice Sarah Wyllie
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 24 January 19 08:10 GMT (UK) »
From RAF records: Charles Dominic Heanon born Islington, London, 22 September 1892. Sister Violet in a convent at King William Town, South Africa.
UK Census info. Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk