Author Topic: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond  (Read 145 times)

Offline londonscorpion

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A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« on: Friday 08 February 19 15:46 GMT (UK) »
I have found the Roll of Honour record for Hugh Victor Diamond (b 1881 in Brixton) who served in the Royal Fusiliers.  Can someone fill in the three gaps. What does this record tell us. I would be particularly interested to know how a Private in the Fusiliers can get be to a Major in the Tank Corps.
 
My take is as follows:

Line 1
PS.262   Pte.   DIAMOND Hugh VIctor       19.R.Fus.Pte PS 262       1(a) 14-11-15       20-3-16         BW & V meds issued ????? 226 of 78 Tank Corps             Discharged to Commission 25-4-16

Line 2
I.V.X 3758 ????  28.9.23 Auth NW ????? 1/5809
Clark, Clarke, Batchelor, Diamond, Ruddick,
Yorkshire: Oaks, Denton, Sykes

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Offline Christine53

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #1 on: Friday 08 February 19 16:38 GMT (UK) »
I would be particularly interested to know how a Private in the Fusiliers can get be to a Major in the Tank Corps.
 


There is an entry in the Dulwich College Registers for Hugh Warren Victor Benjamin Bromhead Diamond , born 1881 , son of Warren Hastings , surgeon. It states that he enlisted as a Private in the 19th Battalion , R. Fusiliers, which was a University and Public Schools  Battalion. The entry also mentions Oxford O.T.C. , which I believe is Officer Training Corps, in March 1916 , followed by a commission as 2nd Lt in April 1916 and a rise to Captain and then Major in 1918. I don't think it was uncommon for young men to rush to enlist and then be selected for officer training. I'm sure someone else will comment on that and help with your other queries.
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Offline londonscorpion

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #2 on: Friday 08 February 19 16:51 GMT (UK) »
Thanks very much for your help.
Clark, Clarke, Batchelor, Diamond, Ruddick,
Yorkshire: Oaks, Denton, Sykes

Offline MaxD

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #3 on: Friday 08 February 19 19:33 GMT (UK) »
The minor things first.
This is a Royal Fusiliers medal roll of issues to men subsequently commissioned.  The first line is saying that his BW and V medals are;
 
….issued Officers 266 page 78 (meaning recorded on the Officers roll number 226 page 78) Royal Tank Corps

Line two are the office document references related to the issue, they can be ignored.

There is another medal roll for his 1914/1915 Star as a Lance Corporal in France with 19th Battalion Royal Fusiliers from November 1915.

His school, his service number and his first battalion give a lot of clues.  His number was prefixed with PS/ standing for Public Schools.  19th Battalion was the 2nd Public Schools Battalion RF.

Christine 53's outline is on the money.  Having volunteered (perhaps with other Alleynians) as soon as he could, he lost no time after a short spell in France in applying for a commission.  His 1914/1915 Star roll adds more info in that he started with the Machine Gun Corps (Motors) many of whose officers and men transferred to the Tank Corps in late 1916 see;
  http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/machine-gun-corps-in-the-first-world-war/motor-machine-guns-of-the-first-world-war/  (but note he was not there until April 1916).

His officer record at the National Archives will contain what is left of his service in the ranks.
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C1112686 although his medal card and the two rolls (you have one) are on Ancestry  The latter notes he won a Military Cross, see:
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/Edinburgh/issue/13192/page/259

MaxD

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Offline londonscorpion

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 09 February 19 11:59 GMT (UK) »
MaxD, many thanks for that extra info. I have spent a great morning reading around this.

There are a number of dates on the front and back of the Medal Roll Card:

Front 24-4-16: Com. M.M.G. Corps. - I presume this means he joined on this date. Can we know if this would have been in France, or in the UK and then he returned to France?

Back 6-2-19: List of claims submt by GOC ??? ???? Weymouth. - Meaning?

Back 12-9-23: EF9 returned.  - EF9/2242 is referenced on the front. I presume this may be a form of some sort, but what was it for?

Front 28-9-23: - What happened on this date?

I presume the Roll card was originally marked up in red ink and annotated later in blue. What can we deduce from this?
Clark, Clarke, Batchelor, Diamond, Ruddick,
Yorkshire: Oaks, Denton, Sykes

Offline MaxD

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 09 February 19 14:10 GMT (UK) »
24 4 16 is the date he was commissioned in UK into the MMG Corps.  He first went to France with the RF on 14 November 1915 so he would have returned to UK.  The Officer Cadet Battalions were all in the UK.  He went to No 6 Battalion at Balliol College  which adds up with him being one of the first men from 19 Bn RF to leave France on 14 March 1916 (war diary).  Precisely when he joined his MMG Corps unit and later transferred to the Tank Corps only his record will show.

Officers had to claim their medals.  He would have applied to the No 3 Area (a UK administrative area) administrative people (letters are issued in the name of the General Officer Commanding) at Weymouth who submitted his name among other claims on a list in 1919.

28 Sep 1923 is the date on which his medals were issued see both medal rolls.

The EF references will be internal medal office file references that relate to the recording of medal claim/issue/receipt/checking, they mean nothing today.

He appears on the 13 August 1917 daily casualty list - no detail - that will be in his record.

MaxD
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Offline londonscorpion

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 09 February 19 17:00 GMT (UK) »
Thanks again MaxD. Where can I see the entry in the Balliol college register, and the war diary you mention?

Doing a search for EF9 shows that this was the form used to apply for a medal.

I have found a casualty entry on the Genealogist site with a date of 15th August 1917- did you find another one? I will get Hugh’s record from the National Archives to check this out.



Clark, Clarke, Batchelor, Diamond, Ruddick,
Yorkshire: Oaks, Denton, Sykes

Offline MaxD

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 09 February 19 17:40 GMT (UK) »
Apologies, I thought I had amended the reference to the register.  I shall delete that bit from the post.


The war diary for 19 Battalion is at:http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7353843  It can also be found on Ancestry at:

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/60779/43849_2427_3-00000?backurl=https%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fsearch%2fdb.aspx%3fdbid%3d60779%26path%3d&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnBrowsing

Tha casualty list is the same.  15 August was the date the 13 August list was published

MaxD
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Offline MaxD

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Re: A Roll of Honour - H.V. Diamond
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 10 February 19 09:49 GMT (UK) »
Hold on with his record!

I was intrigued by the relatively short time between leaving France and being commissioned as officer training was generally about 4 months and he finished in just over a month.  I took the query to another more specialised forum that I lurk upon and received not just the answer but from someone who has his record and who will gladly share it.

The basic answer ca be summarised as follows:

He was highly likely to have been in the Officer Training Corps at Dulwich and that would have meant the army considered a shorter course was sufficient.  In addition, the syllabus was mostly for infantry officers, the MMG Corps was new and expanding and may not have required a full syllabus.

I have sent a PM about his record.

MaxD
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