60th Rifles

[canman41]

Hello, I wonder if anyone can help me with my family tree ....I have come to a complete halt finding anything about my Great grandfather and both of my Great Great Grandfathers all three of them were in the British army , I know this from birth and marriage certificates,
First my great grandfather William Henry Clarke..... on his marriage cert,1883  it says he was a Sergeant, 1st Batt. kings royal rifle corps ...I cannot find any information on him
Second both my Great Grandfathers also on the Cert. (1st) William Henry Clarke, Color Sergeant, 43rd L. I. ...(2nd) John Humphries,  Private 60th R.Royal Rifles.
The odd part is that on my Great greatmother's birth Cert that my Great-great Grandfather confirms he was in the 60th R.Rifles, but as a Sergeant 1958 some 25 years earlier...all very strange

I Have both birth and marriage certs....

I cannot find any UK army records on any of them .....Can you can help me???

I am in Canada so not easy to get records

[crisane]

Can you give us the dates and places of birth for all three, their wives names so we have a base from which to work.

The odd part is that on my Great greatmother's birth Cert that my Great-great Grandfather confirms he was in the 60th R.Rifles, but as a Sergeant 1958 some 25 years earlier...all very strange

I'm sorry but I don't understand the bit in bold. 

[KGarrad]

I think that's a typo, and should have read 1858?

(1858 + 25 = 1883? )

[crisane]

I think that's a typo, and should have read 1858?

(1858 + 25 = 1883? )

Thanks  the brain wasn't in gear.

[tonepad]

Welcome to RootsChat canman41.

You may find the KRRC museum website of interest:

The King’s Royal Rifle Corps (1755-1966)
1755 – 62nd (Royal American) Regiment of Foot
1756 – Renumbered 60th (Royal American) Regiment of Foot
1824 – 60th (The Duke of York’s Own Rifle Corps)
1830 – 60th (The King’s Royal Rifle Corps)
1881 – The King’s Royal Rifle Corps
1958 – 2nd Green Jackets, The King’s Royal Rifle Corps

http://rgjmuseum.co.uk/our-story/regimental-titles/


Tony

[MaxD]

Dates near to 1881 often cause complications because 1881 was when the British Army underwent a massive reform, one result of which was the cessation of numbered titles in favour of locality/descriptive titles (as you see from the 60th Rifles change to KRRC in tonepad's post).
A similar thing occurred with the 43rd LI (Light Infantry) who became the 1st Battalion Oxford Light Infantry in 1881.

the point of this history lesson (forgive me) is that William Henry Clarke 43rd LI had either retired from the army by 1883 or (and it did happen) was still using informally the old regimental title.  This makes it just that bit more difficult to find a record. The same thing applies to John Humphries who in 1883 if serving would be KRRC.

Hence the plea for more dates and places.

MaxD

[canman41]

Thank you everyone for your input,

 yes, it was a typo "1958" should have read "1858"

One thing I left out of the Marriage Cert 1883 was that William Henry Clarke (jnr) address was given as "City of Dublin Royal Barracks".

There is no indication that any of them were not still serving in the British Army at that time.

The marriage took place in St Philip and St James Church, Whitton, I am assuming the bride came from Whitton

Born 1858, William Henry Clarke, Sergeant, 1st Batt. kings royal rifle corps. his wife was Mary Theresa Humphries born 1957 in Colchester, Essex, England

William Henry Clarke 43rd LI , date of birth unknown also his wife's name and date of birth unknown

John Humphries , private/sergeant of 60th R.Rifles , date of birth unknown, wife was Caroline Allsopp also date of birth unknown

[MaxD]

None of the on line sources turn up any identifiable Clarkes or Humphries, for that period that result is not unusual.  While the muster book of the KRRC for 1882-1884  (WO 16/1856 at Kew) will have the 1858 born William Henry listed, these records are simply lists of names serving in the regiment at each quarter of the year, they have no family information for example.   The use of the pre 1881 titles does indicate that the individuals were not serving at the time but searches pre 1881 for these also drew a blank.John Humphries married Caroline Allsop in the Medway registration district in 2nd quarter 1850 which rather reinforces the thought that he was retired from the army 33 years later. 

What can be checked is that 1st Battalion  KRRC were stationed in Dublin in March 1883.
Others may have more luck!

The bride did come from Whitton, it appears in the parish register record.



MaxD

[canman41]

Thanks MaxD,

I will see what I can find for myself regarding John Humphries married Caroline Allsop. 1850

I am not 100% sure that , William Henry Clarke, Sergeant, 1st Batt. kings royal rifle corps was born 1858....I am not sure where I got that date from.

Could you tell me how I can check that 1st Battalion  KRRC were stationed in Dublin in March 1883.? or at least point me in the right direction.

Thanks again