Very old picture on sheet metal for Date please Possibly McMarth

[sugarbakers]

I find the census info inconclusive, but would suggest the little lad in the middle is Hugh McMarth son of William, maybe 6 or 7. He's 9 in 1901 census, so photo about 1898 or 1899. The older of the two girls with hats would be Elizabeth about 11 or 12, but I can't find the other girl. I think these may be children of William as well as his son William, but not sure.

William senior died 1908, and Hugh senior was widowed in 1907.
(Whilst there were sons born to both William's, I think, in 1901, neither survived beyond 1903)

Added ...

Further info regarding Hugh senior, William and Hugh jun on my database at  www.mawer.clara.net/sugarmmac.html .

The book "The Plaistow Story" by Oliver Lyle 1960 is an excellent history of Lyle's refinery, before and after the amalgamation with Tate's. Hugh and William are photographed 1892 and in 1895.
[I was going to suggest looking online for a copy, but just looked !!!!!]

It's possible that a McMarth was still working there during WWII. A rather narrow section of the works is described in "The Sugar Girls", by Duncan Barrett & Nuala Calvi, Collins, 2012. ISBN 978-0-00-744847-0.

Any further help, please just ask.

[Gadget]

Really excellent info sugarbakers 

Gadget

[Peterichards]

The location, I think, is in the Silvertown area of Essex ... the date I'm a little less certain about, but probably turn of century depending upon whose son that is centrally in photo.

The two gentlemen are William and Hugh McMarth. Both sugar refiners at Lyle's at Plaistow Wharf, who lived at 9 & 11 Boxley St/Rd, North Woolwich, in 1901. They were two of the original workers at Lyle's photographed in 1892 outside the works (they look a little younger in that photo). Over time 4 generations of McMarths worked at Lyle's.

William McMarth was one of my Great Grandfathers his daughter Elizabeth was my Fathers mother my Father and I both worked at Tate&Lyles Plaistow wharf.
I wanted dating of this picture because none of the ladies or children in this picture resemble the wives and children of William and Hugh and I thought that the photo was much earlier. However from previous posts re this picture's age and the style of dress of the subjects it is probably late 1890s. I think this photo was taken in Ireland, a cousin has since told me that the she was told that the two men visited Ireland a number of times, the ladies in the picture have a strong likeness to the brothers it is possible that they may be mother and sisters with their own children.
All I have to do now is trace William and Hughs mother's records they were from Coleraine originally.
Thankyou all for your help
Peter Richards

[sugarbakers]

... the ladies in the picture have a strong likeness to the brothers it is possible that they may be mother and sisters with their own children.

... which could explain why the Silvertown census does not agree with the number and ages of the children in the photo. So very little of my posts was relevant